IrmaJean Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) http://www.oprah.com/own-super-soul-sunday/Excerpt-Daring-Greatly-by-Dr-Brene-Brown It isn't about denying the possibility of pain, Resolute. We would always be aware of that possibility, but hopefully not allow our fear of its potential to control our lives and keep us in hiding. This is very challenging for sure. Edited February 24, 2016 by IrmaJean Adding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 my main point isn't about it being changing per se. it's about the odds of things ever working out. they're in no way encouraging. and what happens if when one's attempts at happiness backfire and that person falls apart? who's gonna pick up the pieces? and how many times must this happen to someone before he/she accepts/realizes that it's just not worth it? i've watched the video, but haven't read the excerpt yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 I'm never able to read this stuff. I find flaws within the first few paragraphs and lose interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 Just bullshit opinions from salespeople. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 24, 2016 Report Share Posted February 24, 2016 is she actually saying that exposing ourselves to pain, suffering and loss is the purpose and meaning of living? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victimorthecrime Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 My take away from the article is to not let fear of being vulnerable or being perceived as weak get in the way of living the life you want. For example a great singer who never performs due to stage fright. Thats all fine and dandy but when applied to relationships the benefits have to outweigh the cost and for men I doubt it often does. Just my opinion. I gave my reasons on the 'awful caveat' thread. But I am keeping an open mind and do realize that it is a big world out there w a lot of stories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrmaJean Posted February 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 I think she is saying that we need to expose ourselves to the risks in order to have the connections and the sense of belonging that so many of us are seeking. Res, you mention the possible negative outcomes, but what is the alternative? There is no chance if we don't try. The author researched this for 10 years. Fwiw, this is what I believe in and the way I try to live my life. Victimorthecrime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 In general life sure I agree we should put ourselves out there. Sharing our flaws & vulnerabilities helps us to embrace them through SFP, which in turn helps overcome defense mechanisms ergo discovering our true selves. It would probably help prevent mental health problems too. The author seems to have missed important stuff out though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 1 hour ago, IrmaJean said: I think she is saying that we need to expose ourselves to the risks in order to have the connections and the sense of belonging that so many of us are seeking. Res, you mention the possible negative outcomes, but what is the alternative? There is no chance if we don't try. The author researched this for 10 years. Fwiw, this is what I believe in and the way I try to live my life. i don't think you need to devote a decade of your life to conclude what most people already know: that in real life risk is involved in most things, for most people. you say "possible negative outcomes" i say "probable and almost definite (based on experience, observation and statistics) negative outcomes". can you explain to me what risk does an extremely attractive person (who's also good in bed) take by seeking casual relationships with people showing interest in him/her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 Although I value this kind of intimacy the cost is usually respect. Some men are able to win it back through other positive traits such as good looks, money, sexual desirability or other outstandingly positive characteristics. For the men on this forum that is a big ask. Most women sexualise respect for a man so she could end up fancying him much less. Lost a lover gained a partner sort of deal. It could also emasculate him by creating a culture of emotional dependence which most women would almost always use as collateral to cut him off from other dependable people in his life which further facilitates the conquering/unfancying phenomenon. If she's pretty relative to his positive manly attributes the above processes would be more impactful. Just my thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 Men have things way harder than women. It's the inconvenient truth. Victimorthecrime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 This is why I find relationships difficult. I know when I'm being chastised & emasculated and it makes me suffocated. With an inadequate arsenal of sexies, I'm fucked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 we both agree that respect, dignity, pride, etc. is the price for so called happiness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 I'm speaking exclusively for disclosing vulnerability in a relationship paradigm where a man's sexual desirability is outweighed by his female partner. Outside of that, happiness or watered down representations of it can be achieved by relentless pursuit provided it's realistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 problem is, even those who want love can't achieve it by being vulnerable, because there can be no actual love without respect. @Small i disagree with your last post. in a relationship where both parties are undesirable, even if the woman was more undesirable, she might still fancy desirable men, which would make her partner a fool at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrmaJean Posted February 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 I don't think it's a matter of being vulnerable, it's the choice of allowing it to be seen. The vulnerability of others is something that I respect deeply and any person who has shown this to me, I have felt closer with. I think when we share that with another person and they take care of our needs when we do, it draws us closer. My thought is if the person you share your vulnerability with loses respect for you having shown this, you aren't sharing with the right person. It's a risk, I understand. I know I would personally feel a deeper respect for that person. When I was in therapy it was so difficult to talk openly with my therapist at first that I used to write him notes and would then ask him to leave the room to read them. Some months into my sessions there was something deeply private that I needed to reveal. I can remember shrinking down in the chair and closing my eyes and he was guessing what I was trying to say and eventually he did... He was very gentle with me that day and after that session my therapy work truly began. Maybe I can find my blog post from some years ago when I wrote about this. I will look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 idk about you and small, but there's miscommunication between you and i. everything you say only applies to so called serious relationships between two people, whereas i'm only interested in casual relationships with hundreds (or at least tens) of gorgeous women. i really doubt that exposing any vulnerability serves anyone in such a scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrmaJean Posted February 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 Okay, I hear you. Outside of the context of relationships though, I hope when you sense your own vulnerability, you can be gentle with yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 when i sense my own vulnerability? i never stop sensing it. that's the problem. it's an ever-present feeling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrmaJean Posted February 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 I can see how that would be exhausting, Res. Do you also sense other aspects of yourself? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 it's mainly the body/self-image awareness problem. awareness of my undisputed sexual unattractiveness. the constant, ever-present self-consciousness that varies in intensity depending on situation. other than that, i also have a constant awareness of how fundamentally different my reasoning, thinking and beliefs are with almost everyone i meet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Small Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 I feel that way too Res. Good description. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victimorthecrime Posted February 26, 2016 Report Share Posted February 26, 2016 I just tuned in. Yes that was well said Res. I feel less that way than I used to but that is only because I am 53 and just don't care as much. But HS & college - yeppers. In the unlikely event that I am ever in a relationship w a woman and she wanted to see my vulnerabilities I would ask "why? To what end?". And "do you not realize that if had dwelled on my vulnerabilities I would not be here w you?". Meh, it's all good. This just might be one of those issues men & women see differently. Like vigilantly justice lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resolute Posted February 26, 2016 Report Share Posted February 26, 2016 7 minutes ago, VictimofBullyingNo1cared said: I just tuned in. Yes that was well said Res. I feel less that way than I used to but that is only because I am 53 and just don't care as much. But HS & college - yeppers. In the unlikely event that I am ever in a relationship w a woman and she wanted to see my vulnerabilities I would ask "why? To what end?". And "do you not realize that if had dwelled on my vulnerabilities I would not be here w you?". in other words, "can it, lady" lol. Victimorthecrime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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