Why do women compare the two...

[thouroghlyunhappy]

As a male whom grew up with other males talking about girls, I can tell you that you would be hard-pressed to find a guy that would outright reject a female because of her breast size. And even if a guy doe's prefer bigger breasts, he's certainly not going to turn down sex with a girl because her breasts are too small, and he's DEFINITELY not going to make fun of her or laugh at her breast size. Sure, some guys have preferences, and I've heard guys say stuff like "man, she's got a nice set", however I've never, ever, ever heard a guy say "man, this girls breasts are too small to make me orgasm", or "there's no point in having sex with her, her breasts are too small", lol, it just doesn't happen. It's simple, really: Small breasts don't render one sexually dysfunctional whereas a small penis does. A woman's worries about her breast size are all in her head------a guy who worries because he's hung like a 10 year old has an actual physical problem.

[Cece.dedesl]

A small penis doesn't render one sexually dysfunctional either. There is more than one way to enjoy sex and bring a partner pleasure. One could say it's all in your minds as well.

I had no problems reaching an orgasm with my below average ex husband. Our sex life was great until he started focusing all his attention on his penis and none on me. Seems to me like it was all in his mind.

Look around on the Internet. They market bullshit breast enlargers just like with penises. There are jokes degrading women with small breasts. Women who talk about their boyfriends and spouses making fun of their breasts, ect...

[thouroghlyunhappy]

I'll just agree to disagree as it's become clear that others are incapable of understanding this issue--period.

Unless your a man and have been told that your very small , unless you've been asked "is it in yet?", unless you've been laughed at, unless you've been rejected because of a small penis, unless you've lost your erection because its so small and there's not enough friction to keep it erect, unless you've been unable to make your girl orgasm, unless you've been unable to orgasm yourself due to the lack of friction, unless you've had the experience of it falling out 15-20 times during intercourse because its too small, unless you've been unable to get your girl in the position that she wants because your too small, unless you've had a girl cheat and/or leave you because it's too small, unless you've had a girl say to you after sex "I didn't feel anything", unless you've had girls talk and joke about you behind your back because your so small, unless you've been in the situation where you can't pursue the kind of women that you want because your too small, unless you've been told that you'll have to settle for whatever woman whom will have you because your so small, unless you've been in a situation where you can't really compete with your friends for women because they all have normal penises and you don't---then there's no way of understanding this.

Women whom are okay with small penises are very rare, and women whom desire small penises are even more rare. True, women can be satisfied in ways other than intercourse, but the vast majority of women want normal sized penises attached to the men whom they are with, and with most women--the bigger the better. Thats just life, it is what it is whether we like it or not.

[Cece.dedesl]

It sucks to have someone minimize how you feel about something that causes you pain, doesn't it?

I will agree to disagree as well. If I have learned one thing from my own personal experience with men with penis issues is you can't get through to them, ever.

[malign]

Meh. One thought, if this conversation is turning out the same as similar conversations you've each experienced out in the outside world, is that here we can stop and ask ourselves why.

First off, there's no competition: no one's pain is "more" than anyone else's.

Second, if you don't understand why someone says something, it's probably not because they're stupid. Let's start by assuming the other person really does believe what they say they believe, even if it seems strange to us.

So, my answer to the topic question, "Why do women make a comparison to breast size?", is because they think there is a comparison to breast size. I understand clearly that most of the guys here disagree, but that's actually a little beside the point. To the women, it may make sense, and if you accept that, maybe the next step is to wonder how they feel about their body image. It may or may not be the same as how you guys feel about yours, but at least wondering might give you some insight into how someone else thinks. You already know how you think, after all ...

We may never get any certainty that we understand how other people feel. It's worth trying, though.

[Cece.dedesl]

There is no competition. It's women going out of their way to show compassion and sympathize with men who's knee jerk reaction is always to tell us we can't possibly relate.

Maybe we can't totally relate but at least we are trying. We do believe we've shared similar emotions of inadequacy, undesirability, rejection, disappointment, ect....

It is horribly frustrating to try and show empathy and support towards someone (people) who blow you off simply because you have never had a small penis. Even worse is being told your experiences are imagined or not valid or worthy enough to be deemed as important.

It's truly not worth the effort.

[IrmaJean]

I'm sorry you are feeling unheard and upset, Cece.

I have always related to the men here in some way due to a physical issue (nerve damage) I have from childbirth that leaves me unable to achieve orgasm. I felt broken and "less" for some years, but not so much now. I also watched my mom suffer after having a breast removed due to cancer.

I hope we can all support one another. All of us here in the community are hurting in some way.

[Cece.dedesl]

Thanks Irma, I'm just frustrated and sad. My whole existence seems to revolve around a penis these days. I shouldn't have logged in here. It just mirrors what I am facing at home. I thought I could find some strength or hope but you can't find hope in hopeless situations.

[Thermonuclear Warrior]

For what it's worth Cece, I appreciate your posts. It's definitely valuble to hear acceptance from female posters. I agree with you in that we all have feelings of inadequacy, and it's key to relate here rather than dismiss each other.

[thouroghlyunhappy]

I'd have to say---it's not about dismissing anyone, it's about being honest. And CeCe's man is certainly lucky to have found that rare woman whom is willing to accept his penis.

I wasn't trying to be mean, insensitive, or minimize your problems, no, I was simply pointing out the fact that there's no way to fully understand what it's like to be us unless your a fully grown man with an abnormally small penis. Our issue is like none other. I mean, whether one is going bald, has small breasts, has a big nose, is ugly, is over-weight--- or whatever---sure, these things suck but can be worked through. We all have our problems, but this is a particularly cruel one. Many problems can be solved with a little therapy and then folks can move on to live relatively normal lives---not so for many of us here. The best that some of us can do is learn to accept it and get by the best we can and never be normal. Me, I'd rather be blind in one eye and missing my teeth than have an abnormally small penis. I'd simply wear an eyepatch, pop in some dentures, and would undoubtedly have a better life than the one I'm living now. Lol, heck, I'd rather be a grown man with small breasts than have an abnormally small penis, lol.

peace

P.S I can turn this thing around: Sometimes I feel like we're being dismissed, as if people are unable to grasp the seriousness of this problem. Sometimes I get annoyed when I hear someone compare this to relatively simple issues that can be easily solved. It's like comparing someone being blind with someone having a headache, I can't understand it. Sorry.

[Cece.dedesl]

Thanks Thermo,

I appreciate you guys too. I've gained a lot if positive insight with most of my interactions here.

I think it's important that everyone's feeling are validated. As Malign said, it's not competition. We can all relate to each other on the emotional aspects even if we can't all relate on the physical aspects.

This topic hit a cord because of my own personal issues. It wasn't even the breasts, it was more about not having my support and love accepted because I'm "unable" to relate or understand because I don't have penis issues. I do have penis issues damn it! You don't have to have penis to go through this roller coaster! Lol

At the end of the day, it would be nice to know that even though you guys are unhappy with your penises that you could accept the support and believe that women who offer it want to be there for you. That we can understand and relate at least on an emotional level.

[Thermonuclear Warrior]

I'd happily accept your approval in the event that you gave it. I am not the type of person that is desperately seeking approval from everyone though. I know for a fact that realistically, I am normal and I'd rather not have any weaknesses just because my penis isn't of spectacular length or girth. There are people on this board that are truly incapable of having normal sex due to their length, and those are the people that need help. Both thoroughlyunhappy and I are equivalent to a flat chested female in terms of appearence and functionality. One can argue the importance of the penis vs. the breasts for sex, but in terms of image and self perception we are the same.

Personally, I feel that many of the posters on this forum are depressed more so from other issues. I personally have a slew of issues, including sleep depravation, intense schedule, extremely difficult course work etc that all contribute to my depression. It's easy to blame my penis for my problems. However, I realize now that iti's not the case. if i was more successful in life, my penis wouldn't be receiving as much obsession as it does now. However, I'm not what I'd consider successful yet, and I am working on it. I feel that the more I accomplish with school, the better I feel personally. In my differential equations class, I got the highest grade, outsmarted all of the engineers despite my small penis. I take pride in the fact that I could potentially be launching rockets into space more than potentially having sex with 300 women. There is seroiusly more to life than sex alone and many of the people with this 'syndrome' are more normal than they think. Once you come to terms with the fact that you are normal , you may realize that it is time to get on with your life.

Thoroughlyunhappy: perhaps what truly ruined your life is your past behavior and the people you were surrounded by, not your penis. Statistically speaking, you are the close to the same size as roughly 50% of the adult male population..and so am I. It really bothers me that even people in a happy relatoinship still demand reassurance even after they are told they are fine. For me personally, if a woman that shared mutual attraction with me was stayign with me for 18 months, I would pretty much nullify the idea that my penis is an issue.

[thouroghlyunhappy]

There is seroiusly more to life than sex alone and many of the people with this 'syndrome' are more normal than they think. Once you come to terms with the fact that you are normal , you may realize that it is time to get on with your life.

Thoroughlyunhappy: perhaps what truly ruined your life is your past behavior and the people you were surrounded by, not your penis. Statistically speaking, you are the close to the same size as roughly 50% of the adult male population..and so am I. It really bothers me that even people in a happy relatoinship still demand reassurance even after they are told they are fine. For me personally, if a woman that shared mutual attraction with me was stayign with me for 18 months, I would pretty much nullify the idea that my penis is an issue.

While I definitely chose the wrong path, the fact of the matter is that I went from being an out-going, well-behaved, normal, "academically gifted" kid whom skipped a grade in school to beginning my path towards being a loser right around the time that I realized my penis was abnormally small...and the psychologist that I worked with for awhile seemed to agree---something to do with "coping mechanisms" and "doing things to gain acceptance from others".

So, yeah, the small penis thing sorta set off the chain-reaction that destroyed my life.

And when I talk of my life being "ruined", I'm talking about not being normal. At this point, I couldn't care less about achieving status or wealth or doing anything great. No, I'd rather have those things that make life worth living (things that are free for most people): Satisfying sexual relationships, a wife, children. Just to be normal, to go pick up women with my friends and know that I can deliver the goods. Normalcy, that's all.

And there's no comparison with the small breasts dude! Small breasts have nothing to do with sexual satisfaction. And if you want to believe that your normal, go right ahead---and perhaps you are normal, depending on where you live--but trust me, you wouldn't be considered normal here. No, you'd get laughed at and dumped for a black guy or something, lol. Maybe the guys are all hung in this region? I don't know, but those average sizes that people hold up as the standard don't seem to apply here.

[Bestcobra]

Honestly most of the point I was trying to point out here is that while women with small breasts can actually find a lot of people that "LIKE" small breasts and not just accept them, men with small penises can not find that. I understand that everyone is trying to help in this matter and show that they care, but one of the reasons I've decided to stop looking for someone to be with at all is because I don't want to just be "accepted" physically I want to be liked in that way. There's a lot of things that for some reason people can like, I even know a few people that think scars make people look more distinguished and prettier(one person thinks self harm scars are that way, I think scars from accidents and such tell more of a story and get my attention more, but that's just me) I've actually liked someone long distance before that had one side of her face burned, I thought her face was beautiful but we talked a lot and she deciced we could never date because of distance/family and all this other stuff. But anyway my point is, even that girl I didn't just accept the fact that she had that scar on her face I liked that she had it because it was part of her past and it just made her how she looked then, it wasn't her fault. I wasn't trying to start fights here, but yes I've heard a lot of women say they'll accept someone with a small penis I understand that. But I don't want to just be accepted, in that case in my opinion whatever woman I would be ending up with deserves to be with someone better that she can like physically. No physical attraction is not all that matters, but I'm not someone that can be in a relationship when I feel like the person deserves better than me, everyone wants to be equal with the person they're with not more and not less. Also cece you kept saying "YOU" and as I stated, I know more than 10 guys that I know in person that likes smaller or even flat chests. I didn't say only I like them better, if it was just me that likes them then I would actually agree with all of this and assume I'm a rare case of a man that likes small breasts but that's not the case, a lot of men prefer small breasts. For example of something, if you're with a guy and he starts licking your chest do you want him to say "this is alright but your boobs are too small, but that's alright". No you don't want to hear that, you want to know how much he enjoys it and how much he likes them. I get the fact that people are trying to empathize with this matter but honestly as I said in an earlier post, I would feel more related to women that are born with naturally wide/big vaginas cause not as many men would get pleasure from it. This being the case, there are still men who like women like that and men that are just too big to be with other women. I'm just trying to get you guys to understand that I don't see breasts and small penises as being comparable because breasts are something that regardless of the size ARE often liked, even women with completely flat chests. Where as men with very small penises do not get people to tell them that they like it. If lucky, they find someone who can only "accept" their problem. This is all I was trying to say.

[Cece.dedesl]

This is one of the brick walls I've run into in my my marriage and my current relationship. I didn't just "accept" them. I could honestly care less how big a penis is. It's impossible to tell a man with this issue that you are happy and sexually satisfied and have them believe you.

If I had a nickel for every time I've heard "you deserve better" I would be a rich woman. I'm not a glutton for punishment. If I was unhappy, if I wanted someone else I would go find someone else.

It amazes me that the guy I dated who lost the use of his penis when he was 18 was more sexually confident and at peace with himself than my ex and my current boyfriend who are blessed to have working penises.

[IrmaJean]

Cece, I hear your frustration.

I think your boyfriend needs to be open to challenging his preconceptions in order for change to happen. It isn't easy, but it is possible, if he allows it to be. Is he opening up at all in therapy?

What helps you right now? Are you still in individual therapy?

I'm sorry you're hurting.

[Bestcobra]

You're still not getting the point...Yes you like the people, I get that. If you tell someone you like their penis and they don't believe you there's nothing you can do about that. But I don't ever see women saying they like small penises, and I don't know if you've ever actually told someone that, if so then that's a different story altogether. If someone that I normally believed about everything else would tell me she likes my penis and is happy with it then yes I would believe her. But that's not the case for most guys like me, they just get accepted and that's the same for me. I've had a girl I considered my best friend at one point who always was really empathetic and seemed to actually care about everything I thought, she always tried to make me feel better when she could. But when I finally tried to tell her about this problem she said that didn't matter to most people and that if I was so worried about it I could even let her see it and she would tell me for sure, and the first thing she did as soon as I showed her is cover her mouth, start laughing and just say she was sorry, then walked out the room laughing. This is just about what happens to me every time. My ex left me a week and a half after finding out how big my penis was and both of these girls were even virgins at the time. Finding someone that actually likes the way I am, that would be an absolute miracle. But it doesn't matter I stopped looking for anyone to be with, and I'm in an absolute shit mood now so if my comment seems hateful or something I'm sorry but I prolly won't be on here for the next couple days.

[Cece.dedesl]

No Irma, he says what he thinks the therapist wants to hear then tells me how he really feels later.

I had stopped my individual therapy but I have been considering scheduling a solo appt.

Best Cobra,

I will make this perfectly clear. I like my boyfriend's penis! I don't just accept it because I like him. He's the one who doesn't like his penis.

I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with women but we are not all like those women.

[Bestcobra]

Then you're a very rare case, if someone ever told me that I would believe them but I don't think I'll ever be that lucky to find someone like you or erma. Maybe if I didn't have my personality that I do along with it, but I just don't see it being possible for me to ever find someone that'll like me for being the way I am.

And I know all women aren't like that, I just don't think I'll be able to find one that's like the two of you. I should've never even started any of this conversation cause now I'm just going back into pretty hard depression and it's my own fault, sorry for making such a big deal out of everything and making it seem like I wasn't even listening to anyone elses point of view. At this point I just feel like I don't even deserve to have people to talk to so I'm sorry for acting so shitty lately.

[Jessie]

Gosh- I can so understand all the views here.

Cece does 'like' her partners size- but her boyfriend wont believe her- and its ruining things.

I also can totally see how breast size can effect woman's self esteem.

But the guys do have an irrefutable point:

Small boobs ARE sexy- I would say 60% of uk guys prefer an slender athletic body with small boobs to a curvy girl with big boobs.

Sure men can admire many body types other than obsese and can adore boobs of varying sizes. And no it doesnt directly impact sex obviously in a physical sense.

But women claim they cannot feel small or slim penises- that kinda ruins a critical element of sex (for most women)

Plus visually and mentally most women claim to be repulsed by small penises.

So small ones are both repulsive and unsatisfying for intercourse.

So there is a fundamental difference. Thats not to say women don't have such feelings- and its a tragedy they suffer when they have in fact such a desirable and covetted body part- happily though many mature and realise they actually are lucky to have what they have.

[Thermonuclear Warrior]

BRILLIANT IDEA:

SMALL PENIS GLORIFICATION PORN:

1) Take a man(me for example) with a smaller than average penis.

2) Put myself in a situation where I am engaging in sex with a porn star.

3) Watch me get criticized and mocked briefly

4) Watch me exit the room and then watch me come back armed ...

<edit - remainder of scenario removed>

This will likely put a nice spin on the 'size matters' perspective. Who wants to be the martyr/murderer that's the star of this potential film?

Also, thoroughlyunhappy, you base your opinions on those of whores and one woman that called you thin. I've been told I was small too, and I let it get to me at first, but now I don't care as much. My problems are not solely related to my penis and I'm sure the same applies to you. It's easy for you to blame your penis, but outside factors play a role. I would never guide my life based on the opinoins of a sex worker or even multiple sex workers. They aren't exactly exposed to normal individuas the majority of the time.

I can relate to those that are slightly under average and those that have small penis syndrome. My advice does not apply to those that are outside of the bell cuve of the normal range. I can't give you advice because I do not relate. But I do believe that there are women that do not place supreme emphasis on sex and I believe that there are woman that would choose you regardless of your size.

I personally don't have anythign in common with most people, and that is issue #1. Meeting people is quite difficult when you have ltitle to talk about so it's easy to put blame on somethign that's not the direct cause of my problem. I grew up in a home with lots of yelling and occasional violence, so naturally I'm introverted. Being exposed to the Internet from my early teens, Iimmediately developed insecurities and everything spiraled forward. I was told that I wouldnt amoutn to anythign several times as a kid, so naturally someone like me would be prone to be more self conscious than the average guy. So I still firmly believe that for people like me in the normal range, but under the social average of say 6 x 5 inches, that our penises are only a small part of our problems.

Edited October 12, 2012 by malign
Not an appropriate image

[Bestcobra]

Um yea, I would rather not ... <edit - scenario removed>. People have mocked me my whole life for a thousand different reasons it's just what I'm used to. And I don't care to hurt other people cause of what they've done to me, that's just as wrong as the people that did it then.

I have a lot of other mental and emotional problems due to my past to go along with my very small penis, so for me it just all adds up and becomes a bit too extreme at times. For example most of my life my father would actually tell me, at least 2-3 times a week how worthless I am, how much of a pussy I am, that I was stupid, ugly, fat, would never amount to anything, take your pick of these and I would get quite a few of them throughout every week. After I turned 12, I actually started dealing with him while he was always drunk instead of my mother cause I wanted her to be able to get up and go to work in the morning, sure i had to wake up at 7 after my dad went to bed t 5 in the morning but that didn't matter to me. But yea, those comments came from him when he was drunk or sober, it really didn't matter. And that's just part of my family, uncles have done the same thing, I'm not even going to get into the school thing but I'll say this much at one point I had a bully going to the point of stabbing me in the back with pencils and getting the led stuck in my back. So yea, my problems go a lot further than my penis, but it sure as hell doesn't help a single thing that i have that problem too.

Edited October 12, 2012 by malign
Not an appropriate image

[malign]

Yeah, I can understand anger, but it's just not appropriate to be describing explicitly violent scenarios here. You may not know it, but this site hosts a fairly large number of people who've been the victims of violence, and they don't need that, here where they feel at least a little safe.

And, it really wasn't necessary to the message, so I left the message and removed the details. Generally, we give this forum some extra leeway, because the topic is inherently pretty explicit, and I'd hate for that to have to change.

[thouroghlyunhappy]

Also, thoroughlyunhappy, you base your opinions on those of whores and one woman that called you thin. I've been told I was small too, and I let it get to me at first, but now I don't care as much. My problems are not solely related to my penis and I'm sure the same applies to you. It's easy for you to blame your penis, but outside factors play a role. I would never guide my life based on the opinoins of a sex worker or even multiple sex workers. They aren't exactly exposed to normal individuas the majority of the time.

I understand what your saying here, but most of mine are directly related to penis size, there's no getting around it. Sure, I have many other problems--self-esteem/self-confidence issues,depression, past drug use, etc--but their all inter-related and came about due to my feeling socially unacceptabe. It hurts some of us worst than it does others. I'm glad that your able to deal with it the way that you do, I wish that I could. Were I to wake up tomorrow with a decent penis, there's no doubt in my mind that I'd go out and salvage the second part of my life because I'd feel good, I'd have self-confidence, I'd be able to go out and live life like others, I wouldn't feel hopeless, and I'd have no problem picking up chicks because--even today--I get hit on and flirted with all of the time (and this makes it even more painful.) Dude, its devastating when you know that under normal circumstances you'd be able to pull incredibly hot chicks!

And I've had four other quick encounters with normal girls---I left them out of my original story (and left alot of other things out as well because it would been very long) and included the one that I did because that's the one that hurt the most and pretty much destroyed me. But anyways, I had lived very briefly with a guy whom I grew up with and he'd bring chicks over all the time, it was a party house more or less and we were young, and with these other four it was the exact same thing: "I don't feel anything", "Is it in yet?", and/or that blank, bored expression on their face--and these were teenage girls! My penis hasn't grown a bit since then, so what do you think an experienced adult female with children will think about it? And I don't reject the opinions of the prostitutes that I've known because--in addition to having sex with many, many men--they too were regular chicks once upon a time and had normal sex just like everyone else, so their opinions are as good as any--they're still women and know what women want and what normal penises look like.

The whole deal with this thing is not to dispute the uselessness of my penis or how it's wrecked my life, no, the issue is this: Are we truly hopeless, or is it possible to be okay and feel happy with ourselves? And the way things are going, it's not looking so good for me. I can't even imagine being okay with this...I just want to be able to bang chicks like everyone else but can't, and it's driving me insane. Just when I start feeling half-way okay, something as simple as going to the grocery store and seeing hot chicks everywhere in booty shorts, or seeing couples with kids, or having a female flirt with me at an AA meeting, lol, makes me want to commit suicide! I'm very good with meditation and have learned how to direct my thoughts, change my mood almost at will--and I've had therapy....but still feel like crap. I just don't know what to do. I'm constantly trying to bring myself to be okay with this situation and make the best of it, but I'm just getting worse.

[Cece.dedesl]

It's unfortunate that a lot of body issues are realized at such a young age. Children and teenagers lack the mental maturity to deal with these matters and the damage it creates has a domino effect on the rest of our lives if not properly dealt with.

It's never too late to get help but I know from experience, the longer we let these issues fester and grow, the longer they takes to overcome.