New here; food for thought

[EternalDarkness]

Hi guys,

I've lurked here for a while but finally decided join.

Some members here seem very distraught (understandably so) regarding their size, and I felt compelled to at the very least inform you of the possible benefits of penis enlargement excercises. I realize that many of you are probably rolling your eyes as you read this, but they DO work. Unlike the pills and other scams, manual exercises do not require any monetary investment (except for a lubricant for jelqing).

Sites such as PE Gym and Thunder's Place are dedicated to manual PE, and contain loads of information on the topic. Registration is not required (unless you wish to post on the forum).

This has changed lives.

[Notdoneyet]

Won't say this doesn't work for "some". Just never worked for me.

[malign]

I'm not sure I agree with you about enlargement techniques. I have heard about the possibility of the exercises harming some who try them.

But you're welcome to your opinion, and it's open for discussion.

[Jessie]

I take a sterner view.

There is ZERO, repeat ZERO, concensus approved, peer reviewed, verifiable MEDICAL, CLINICAL evidence to suggest exercises works.

Not one scintilla of evidence to suggest a gain of even a single mm.

And the 1st person to succeed in doing so will become world famous and a multi billionaire.

If there were any truth in this don't you think the NHS would have been doing this for the past 20 years or a Hollywood clinic?

Currently there is NO way to increase erect size other than surgery which is expensive, dangerous and has very poor results, indeed often making the situation many times worse.

Sorry for the bad news.

Beware the snake oil merchants.

[Jessie]

It's more likely a variance in measurement technique and/or state of arousal skynight.

the penis is made of a type of muscle that does not enlarge or elongate with pressure/tension.

If it did it would simply be longer but thinner as there is no way to add cells nor enlarge the cells post puberty completion.

Over decades some cell loss, circulation loss and lack of elasticity can cause older men to have a a degree of shrinkage of the erect organ.

This is also true of some men who have had cancer treatment or ironically enlargement operation attempts due to scarring.

Older men sometimes have larger ears or noses as they have the type of cells and structure that precipitate this but penises don't.

if you doubt anything I'm saying please use up to date clinical, western, MEDICAL information on this.

please do not trust forums, pill companies, plastic surgeons or stretching advocates.

Being small is bad enough without being ripped off or misled too.

[Wastedlife]

I followed Thunder's Place advice religiously for a year. Never gained anything....it might work for some but not for everyone.

[EternalDarkness]

G'day,

I'm posting from my phone, so I apologize if my initial post was abrupt and lacked coherence.

Before I start, I'd like to thank Malign for allowing discussion on the topic.

I'll do my best to address the issues brought up.

Firstly, manual excersises involve significant risk. Total and permanent ED is exremely rare, but not unheard of. The risks associated with these excersises can be lessened via the use of good judgement, but obviously can never be fully mitigated. Personally, I would prefer to roll the dice and end up with a damaged penis rather than not attempting enlargement.

Jessie, you are absolutely correct in that there are no verifiable studies supporting enlargement. There ARE a few articles on Pubmed supporting the use of an extending device, however their validity is questionable at best.

To my knowledge, there are very few (if any) studies that refute manual excersises as an option for enlargement. I realize this sounds a lot like an argumentum ad ignorantiam, but it would be much different if the subject had been studied rigourously and found to be ineffective. Just because supporting peer-reviewed material is non-existant, does not mean that it's a total farce.

The penis is not "made up of some type of muscle". There are three chambers in the penis that, when engorged with blood, produce an erection. These chambers are comprised of erectile tissue, not muscle. The only muscular component of the penis are a couple of bundles of smooth muscle, which, when relaxed, allow blood to flow into the chambers and inflate the erectile tissue. Virtually all types of tissue can undergo hyperplasia; is it not unique or exclusive to certain types or locations in the body. This also only relates to the internals, and not the collagenous tissue or suspensory ligaments.

Wastedlife, it does seem that there are some people who cannot gain no matter what. This is where the lack of scientific research really hurts. Nobody knows why some experience gains, and some do not.

In closing, I'd like to make it clear that I do feel your pain. I deal with feelings of extreme inadequacy every day, and the resulting depression becomes overwhelming at times. Despite this, I continue with my routine. I haven't seen any appreciable length increases, however I do seem to be thicker. When I started, I could fit my glans and upper shaft into a toilet paper roll before bottoming out mid-shaft. Now, nothing fits. I did this multiple times months ago to verify, and I've been doing it every day for the last three weeks.

If nobody here is interested, feel free to request the thread locked and deleted. It is not my intention to aggravate.

[Jeep]

.

[malign]

Unless it gets a lot more acrimonious than this, I don't plan to shut this thread down. Why? Because you're not promoting anything commercial, and after that, it's just an exchange of opinions, which is basically what we're here for. I'm certainly not promoting exercises; we're just discussing them.

That said, the first thing I would caution anyone is that the more you'd pay to have something "fixed", the more likely it is that you'll be ripped off by someone claiming to have the solution. Next, the possible dangers of any treatment should be considered.

However, the reason that I'm interested in this discussion is because it presents an opportunity to introduce the question of attitude. What if the difference between men who say they've experience growth and those who haven't were some other factor, one that studies can't really measure? That would account for anecdotal accounts of success as well as the inconclusiveness of the studies.

There's a thing called the "placebo effect". A "placebo" is a medicine that has no effect, given as a substitute for one that may. The classic example is a sugar pill; if you give people sugar pills but tell them they're painkillers, a significant number of people will feel some pain relief. That's the placebo effect, and it's so common that most studies include a control group that gets a placebo without knowing it, as a comparison. It gets better, though: it turns out that it even matters whether the doctor knows which is which. Studies have shown that even if the doctors don't tell the patients which pill is the placebo, their behavior based on knowing has a significant effect. Doctors giving a placebo know that it's a placebo, and somehow reduce its effectiveness, for instance by seeming less enthusiastic that the pill will help. So now drug studies are routinely "double-blind": neither the doctor nor the patient knows which pill is the placebo. It's all done by numbers and controlled by computer, until the end of the study.

So, could the placebo effect matter with exercise too? Maybe some guys believe in the exercises more than others, which might give them confidence. Confidence could affect measurement as well as quality of erection. In other words, believing you've done something useful could very well be the same as actually doing something useful. After all, it's really confidence you guys are after ... Besides, the man's confidence could quite easily translate to a change in the woman's perception, as well.

Just my thoughts.

[Victimorthecrime]

"Size genetics" claims to have data supporting their gain claims. I have no idea but suspect something that works would be known far and wide (no pun intended).

[Jessie]

trust me if there was any scientific validity or possible genuine success a major corporation would have picked up on this and made billions.

Any 'micro improvements' are the placebo thing Malign alluded too.

I wish I was wrong (trust me I so wish I was wrong) but there is no way to enlarge or lengthen the penis.

there is some research on improved surgical techniques and stem cell research and even hormone injections pre- puberty but as it stands today there is no cure for one of the cruellest conditions a human can endure....

[malign]

I know it goes against the scientific grain, but the mind plays a pretty big role in these measurements. The result isn't a "micro improvement"; it could be a measurable improvement, only not reproducible for everyone.

You mentioned earlier one of the most important variables in self-measurement: erection quality. I would suggest that there would be a considerable difference in quality, depending on whether the guy was confident of being "big enough" (it would be his definition of that, and therefore probably not a number), or if the guy was afraid of what the measurement was going to show. The effect of attitude is real, and it may be concretely measurable.

And it probably is difficult to control for, in a study. Some guys doing exercises might change their attitude, some might not. It's even possible that some would make their attitude worse, by thinking something like "all this effort, and I bet it didn't change a thing." The problem with attitude is that you generally get what you expect.

"Whether you think you'll fail

Or you think you'll succeed,

You're probably right."

-- paraphrased from Henry Ford

[mts]

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[Jessie]

Im sorry but I remain convinced that something is creeping into the results somehow be it measurement variance on temp variance or arousal variance.

I have had long conversations with proper qualified urologists and done an enormous amount of research n this.

I know this subject better than many GPs- I know not gonna bore everyone with the science- but Im afraid you cannot 'excercise' your way to a bigger willy any more than you can exercise your way to a bigger nose or a bigger finger.

Biceps can be increased in size- there is a well understood mechanism of broken fibres and reassembly of muscle tissue in greater mass.

This does not work with the tubes and tissue of the penis.

Oh if only!!

I do so want to avoid people reading this and getting false hope to start the cycle of elation and devastation that I have undergone myself and witnessed in cyber space in others.

[flander]

I didn't even try the exercises, I just stopped jerking for 30 days and *hello* and increase of half an inch in length and girth. Turns out I got an improvement in erection quality. Strangely soft size is bigger too. Edit: If you jerk off once or more a day you might want to try it, lol.

but the urologist recommends recommends several times a week to keep the prostrate healthy. What to do, what to do...

[Victimorthecrime]

I read that some men get liposuction on the pubic bone so that penis that was inside the body now appears external.

[Wastedlife]

I didn't even try the exercises, I just stopped jerking for 30 days and *hello* and increase of half an inch in length and girth. Turns out I got an improvement in erection quality. Strangely soft size is bigger too. Edit: If you jerk off once or more a day you might want to try it, lol.

Man wish I could stop masturbating...I only got up to 3 days and I get so horny its impossible to stop. I know its effecting me in a negative way, how did you stop for 30 days??

[mts]

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[Wastedlife]

Well, I shouldn't say "just stopped" it is really hard. Like any habit you have to fail to succeed, repeatedly. Until you learn your triggers. Keep busy. My motivation for doing it was my failings in the bedroom. I was a porn addict, because i felt useless with real women. I don't feel that way anymore, so it helped me. Not saying it will nessecarily help anyone else but I wanted to share just in case.

Yeah I feel I'm a pron addict as well, I masturbate so much that I'm basically impotent on the rare occasion I do get to have sex...but like I said its nearly impossible to stop watching porn and masturbate for longer then day or two...I'm going to give it another shot though, I know its messing hard with my body.

[mts]

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