Penis enlargement community is batshit insane. Cult of madness!

[nytaiji]

Is this sufficient Jessie? http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/223019.php

I jut skimmed it quickly. But don't worry, I have more coming. But as I post links backing my opinion, I ask that you do the same. Show me a study that concluded that it's impossible. NOT A LINK THAT SAYS IT HASNT BEEN PROVEN. A link PROVING that it doesn't work.

[nytaiji]

http://www.livescience.com/3381-penile-extenders-work-doctors.html

[Jessie]

Fluoride isn't just in tap water. It's in most processed food and in tea and coffee. It calcifies the pineal gland which makes you more docile and easier to control, which is why Hitler used it on the Jews in the concentration camps.

Now are just winding us up you naughty monkey you!

[Jessie]

http://www.livescien...rk-doctors.html

mmmm… did you notice the words 'might' and '2009'?

[nytaiji]

I noticed that it concluded that it DID increase length and even 6 months after stopping it stayed the same larger size. That was a pretty conclusive study. No "might" about it.

[Jessie]

Is this sufficient Jessie? http://www.medicalne...cles/223019.php

I jut skimmed it quickly. But don't worry, I have more coming. But as I post links backing my opinion, I ask that you do the same. Show me a study that concluded that it's impossible. NOT A LINK THAT SAYS IT HASNT BEEN PROVEN. A link PROVING that it doesn't work.

In the link you provided its a review of 5 other studies.

The 5 studies were NOT peer reviewed CLINICAL studies in themselves.

It was an article appearing in a journal- not a clinical result.

It was published in 2011. So if its the wonder cure why does the NHS and other western medical practices not shout it from the roof tops?

Answer= its bullshit.

ps its not clear if they claim erect or flaccid improvements- I suspect the latter which is useless anyway to women and its girth not length which is more critical anyhow. But its a moot point here.

[nytaiji]

I'll search for more recent info though while I wait for the link to the study that proved conclusively that it doesn't work.

[Jessie]

I noticed that it concluded that it DID increase length and even 6 months after stopping it stayed the same larger size. That was a pretty conclusive study. No "might" about it.

Yet half a decade later the claims have not been verified- its wasnt clinically proven.

Studies vary in quality and status. At least in this study they used the word 'might'.

Not all publishers are so honest about the shakiness of their claims.

[nytaiji]

I don't feel it's a moot point when you are making it sound very factual that it doesn't work. That was what my original point was. You said there is no proof that it works, so you don't believe it. However, I' waiting to see the proof that it doesn't. Because your line of reasoning is that you need proof to believe something. Yet you seem to be very adamant about it not working. Where's the proof?

[Jessie]

I'll search for more recent info though while I wait for the link to the study that proved conclusively that it doesn't work.

you will only get that after you get the study that shows fairies are not true, that homeopathy is untrue, that fortune tellers are all liars.

There is no good quality science to back up any of this nonsense - but by definition you also wont get 100% evidence showing it IS nonsense- such disproving evidence does not and cannot exist.

What I can tell you is that the James Randi prize remains unclaimed.

[Jessie]

Not with a tape measure.

yes, even with a tape measure!

Its a well documented effect about self assessment errors - particularly when emotional stakes are high.

And penis measurement is prime to error issues anyway- you WANT to be bigger- you push that little bit harder on the ruler because you WANT to go from 5.1 to 5.2.

You force the erection down more than usual to FORCE an extra 0.1 on the scale.

You WANT all the effort to be worth it so you make it work- you twist the ruler a tad to the diagonal till you get the result you want.

Its analogous to the placebo effect which is one of the most powerful effects in medicine.

Did you know a green pill is PROVEN to more effective than a red pill?

[Jessie]

97% of Europe don't fluoridate their tap water, and only 11 countries worldwide expose more than half of their population to it. They base this on the thesis that it's a known toxin with no substantial evidence to suggest ingestion is beneficial, and with significant evidence that shows it's harmful.

But some 'rich' western countries do because the pros massively outweigh the cons.

The evidence is there and you can go onto uk websites (and I assume usa ones too) that explain all this with the evidence links.

Nobody hides this- the government are proud of it and have the full support of the medical and dental community.

[Resolute]

yes, even with a tape measure!

Its a well documented effect about self assessment errors - particularly when emotional stakes are high.

And penis measurement is prime to error issues anyway- you WANT to be bigger- you push that little bit harder on the ruler because you WANT to go from 5.1 to 5.2.

You force the erection down more than usual to FORCE an extra 0.1 on the scale.

You WANT all the effort to be worth it so you make it work- you twist the ruler a tad to the diagonal till you get the result you want.

Its analogous to the placebo effect which is one of the most powerful effects in medicine.

Did you know a green pill is PROVEN to more effective than a red pill?

there goes your modern "medicine".

[Resolute]

But some 'rich' western countries do because the pros massively outweigh the cons.

The evidence is there and you can go onto uk websites (and I assume usa ones too) that explain all this with the evidence links.

Nobody hides this- the government are proud of it and have the full support of the medical and dental community.

yes, big pharma. very reassuring. they don't spend tens of billions of dollars annually for nothing.

[nytaiji]

I prefer to stick to the topic. I don't really care to know about the James Randi prize. Basically, your logic is this.....there is no proof for it and there is no proof against it, therefore it MUST be false. That's not very logical. How about changing your statement to something makes a little more sense? Perhaps, "it could be true but probably not". That's more along the lines of what you're saying. But you are telling me that I need proof to support my claim. Yet you don't have any to support yours. Doesn't seem fair.

[Jessie]

there goes your modern "medicine".

how do you mean?

[Jessie]

yes, big pharma. very reassuring. they don't spend tens of billions of dollars annually for nothing.

oh yeah the big conspiracy thing- of course- deliberate poisoning for profit- but of course.

[Jessie]

I prefer to stick to the topic. I don't really care to know about the James Randi prize. Basically, your logic is this.....there is no proof for it and there is no proof against it, therefore it MUST be false. That's not very logical. How about changing your statement to something makes a little more sense? Perhaps, "it could be true but probably not". That's more along the lines of what you're saying. But you are telling me that I need proof to support my claim. Yet you don't have any to support yours. Doesn't seem fair.

Thats how science works.

If an unlikely claim has zero evidence its assumed false.

I dont believe in fairies or fortune tellers and I dont beleive the extenze adverts.

Homeopaths have quite ludicrous claims (that they genuinely beleive) but every single time a proper study is done it has net zero impact.

It is a sceptical stance but how many zero impact studies (quality studies) would it take for you to accept PE is utter BS?

5? 10? 5000?

Im afraid there will never be a study to prove it CANNOT be true- by definition such a study can never exist- I mean what would such a study look like?

How can you PROVE fairies dont exist? You can't.

[Resolute]

oh yeah the big conspiracy thing- of course- deliberate poisoning for profit- but of course.

yes deliberate poisoning, experimenting on the population, bribing, buying scientists, physicians, etc., faking research or results, and anything else you could think of, for yes, you guessed it, hundreds of billions of dollars in profit. frankly, i'd be surprised if they didn't do all those things.

did you read about obama passing the monsanto law? i'm sure you'll tell me it's for everyone's well being.

[Jessie]

wow deliberate poisoning eh?- goodness me Im so naive.

There was me thinking it was about preventing tooth decay…..

ps I just cannot be arsed to look up the monsanto law- but no doubt its about Obama having some fiendish plot to turn your brains into meat chunks to feed to his pet dog…

[Resolute]

how do you mean?

well, if the strongest your "medicine" has to offer is the placebo effect, i think that says a lot doesn't it?

[nytaiji]

Then maybe you shouldn't put all your eggs into the scientific proof basket. Besides, that's a strawman argument. I'm not asking you to prove fairies don't exist. I'm simply saying that just because a study hasn't been done, doesn't men it's false. If you can show me a study that proves it's false then fine. You were the one that brought up all this science talk. I believe it works based on a few things that I stated way back in the discussion. Your counter argument was all about proof from science. There is none. And just because there is none, doesn't mean a thing. If you believe it doesn't work for other reasons then I'd love to hear them. But your point that there is no data on it doesn't prove your point at all.

[Jessie]

well, if the strongest your "medicine" has to offer is the placebo effect, i think that says a lot doesn't it?

I said it was ONE of the most powerful effects and it is.

Its proven to be extremely powerful in a range of scenarios.

This is why double blind trials are the gold standard - otherwise the placebo effect will contaminate the results.

Clinical medicine is extremely effective e.g. radiotherapy or open heart surgery

[Resolute]

jessie, you say you don't believe in fairies, yet you live in a fairyland. wake up mate.

everything in the corporate world is about profit and power/control. they don't give a shit about you, me or anyone else (besides certain types of people and "elites"). everyone is dispensable to them.

it's a cycle; food and agricultural companies feed us "nutritionless" crap, and the drug companies by giving us useless and harmful drugs (so we keep coming back to buy more, since we're not cured), and the cycle goes on.

the sicker people get, the more money they make.

[nytaiji]

And how many times do "miracles" have to happen that go against science to prove that peer-reviewed clinical studies aren't always 100% correct? How prevelant is acupuncture over here now? 50 years ago American doctors would laugh at the thought of it.