Everyone hates me, I can't get along!

[JaneE]

I'm tired of being such a failure. I can't make it work with people. I try, I really really try but it always ends up people screaming "F*CK YOU" in my face. Literally.

Like tonight. My neighbors were having a party. They don't do it super often, they've gotten better, and only once before have I asked them to please keep it down. Tonight I did too. Our houses are very close together. VERY close, like 10ft apart! They play LOUD music, like walls shaking (MINE that is), thumping you can feel down the street loud music! I'm in my bedroom, MY PERSONAL SPACE. And it's like they're there too! Not fun... it just doesn't seem right or fair to me.

So I put on my robe and walked over to my neighbors and asked them to please keep it down. The girlfriend was polite and said "I'm sorry" and I came home. Next thing I know the boyfriend is banging on my door... and yelling "F*CK YOU" in my face about my asking him to turn their music down. Yes he's drunk.

Then I get a harangue from my husband about what a jerk I am! Who do I think I am asking people to turn their music down? I get to hear about what a "blobstrop face" I am etc. He's often verbally abusive to me anyway, so of course I got no support and he didn't defend me to the neighbor at all!!

I'm seriously bewildered though. Why is what I did such a crime??? I didn't tell them they couldn't listen to any music at all. I didn't say I was calling the cops, I didn't yell "F*CK YOU!" I didn't say they can't have parties or whatever... I really tried my best to be polite!!!!! All I asked them to do was to please keep it down! It was 11:30 at night!

Lately I cannot do anything right. All I hear about is what a jerk I am all the time. I just want to be alone. I try so hard!!!! But I always always fail.

Yesterday my family was out for the day and i had time alone. ALL DAY!! It was SO NICE. Nobody looking over my shoulder and criticizing me, nobody telling me what a jerk I am because I didn't respond to something the "right" way, nobody second-guessing me, nobody telling me my "perceptions are wrong", nobody getting mad at me. God, it was so... *blissful* I just did my work, cleaned up the house... the kinds of things people do, and I felt so weightless!

Then today happened. I'm so tired of this world. I'm so tired of myself and my inability to get along with anyone??? It seems? I think of suicide. Intellectually I know I should die. That wherever I go I'll still be a personality disorder (avoidant) that can't get along. Who says the wrong kinds of things at the wrong time and is never never forgiven for it, who is shunned. I like life... I don't want to die... but I can't make anything work, and I'm soo soooo tired of people screaming "F*CK YOU" in my face, literally and figuratively. I'm so tired of being made out to be the bad guy in my family, the odd one out who is necessarily always wrong... tired of people being angry with me all the time. I wish I had the guts to hang myself. They'd all be so much happier without me around, and the world would have one less defective human cluttering it up for the nice normal people who think it's their god-given right to impose their noise on others in their beds late at night.

I NEVER NEVER do that to them, have NEVER done so! When we have parties I'm careful that they're not noisy. We even have music, but not at outdoor concert decibel levels...!

Ack, sorry for going on. I'm still shaking like a leaf. I feel like the whole world condemns me. Maybe they should. Maybe tomorrow the neighbor will come over and apologize. I'd totally forgive him, too!! But will I be forgiven, or even understood? I really really doubt it. I just want to bury myself in a hole and never see another human ever again.

Anyone else have this problem?? ^^:;

[Someguy]

Wait a minute, 11:30 at night!

You have every right to want to fall asleep or have it be quiet at 11:30pm at night. There are actually zoning laws and law enforceable actions that can be placed upon your neighbors if this is not observed.

Next time call the cops, and if the neighbors harass you put a restraining order on them. If they're gonna be a'holes, be a'holes right back at them.

Frankly, I don't trust alcoholics nor their judgment. They're impaired people and they should be treated as such.......and yeah, I'm jumping to conclusions about your neighbor that he's a FUCKING alcoholic. Well, if he can't control his language I'm gonna assume his judgment is impaired ergo he's an alcoholic.

There are a lot of people who have a strong sense of entitlement out there, narcissists and sociopaths, and the only way you can deal with these people is to be just as forceful as they are. They're vindictive self centered pricks. They wanna behave like a child, treat'm like a child.

[JaneE]

Oh yes, he's very much an alcoholic! His father is too... one time his father chased me around my yard trying to get me to look down his pants!!! D-: But yeah. They can't throw a party or even have friends over without getting blotto, falling about *screaming* most of the time. And these are not kids! They're in their thirties, have good jobs and drive expensive cars!! You should see the girlfriend's diamond engagement ring, it must have cost 20K! So I guess for an alcoholic he does well enough. :-/ Entitled? Yes, probably, but they tell me I'm the entitlement case because I think I'm entitled to have my personal space respected!!

Thank you Someguy for the words of moral support, first I've heard! It sounds like you've had bad experiences with alcoholics... I didn't even think of it from that angle!

I've tried to be friendly with this guy, but he often turns my words against me in conversation, and truth be told, I am kind of scared of him and try to avoid him. I mean, I don't think he'd attack me or anything, but I have never been able to make a friend of him.

Not saying I'm perfect, I'm not so easy with people, but I have tried with him and I have just never been able to connect successfully. I blamed myself, my disorder, but maybe it's not all me?

Argh.

I know I sounded like a nutcase in my first post, sorry, I felt alone and persecuted, though I know it's a foolish situation. My world is too small, and things like this really hurt!

[SweetSue]

Hi jane

I was going to reply earlier, but yeah kinda got side tracked

Just wanted to say that I know how difficult it is having to put up with being treated with next to no respect. (my ex, well he wasnt very nice at the best of times).

Im sorry your husband isnt very supportive and didnt try defend you, when that guy came to your door, that must of been very scarey and infuriating. No one has the right to tell you to "F'off" and you deserve to be spoken to with respect.

You didnt sound like a nutcase in your first post, you sounded upset, and that is perfectly understandable. things like this do hurt hun, it dosnt matter how small your world is. You have feelings, unfortunately, not everyone respects the feelings of others.

Hope you feel a little less hurt soon.

take care

sue

[Symora]

Hi JaneE, I'm sorry your having a rough time today. You don't sound to me like someone people would hate... I think that you are perhaps surrounded by hateful people and you just happen to be their target. You were perfectly in your rights to ask them to turn down their music at that time of night, I've done that before too. People don't really like it but they usually accommodate to some degree.

From what you've described you are in an environment that is degrading to you, where you do not get the support you are entitled to. You need to make the distinction between what mean people say and what is actually real. I'll give you an example, near the end of my marriage I went to see someone at a social service agency because I thought I was going crazy. I splilled my guts about my situation and how guilty I felt about being such as bad mother and wife. Anyway, the lady looked straight at me and said, 'He demeans you, he goes out almost every night and leaves you to take care of the kids, the home, most responsiblities. My dear, you have a distorted view of your situation. You are not the bad person he has convinced you that you are. He has created an illusion that elevates him and demeans you, but it does not represent reality.' That was the first time someone told me it was not me. My family had scapegoated me, and then my husband did, and in my heart I had believed what these people who were supposed to love me had said. But they were wrong, I am a kind an considerate person, perhaps too considerate, and I let them treat me badly without daring to fight them for fear of rejection. I learned to be more assertive after my divorce, some would argue a little too assertive , but when people get angry at me now I don't take on their anger, they own that. As long as I know I have been respectful and moral, I don't feel guilty either.... Perhaps you need to learn a little more about assertiveness, so that you can learn about your boundaries and rights....

Don't take on the comments of mean people, they are representative of them, not of you. When I read your post I thought, 'why is she so down on herself when it's these men who are obviously out of line'. It's not you my dear, some people are just agressive and mean and they usually find a kind and meak person to take it out on.... Nothing fair about it, as a matter of fact I find it rather cowardly....

How come you are taking on their mean behaviour?

[JaneE]

Aw, thanks you guys, for the support. I know it's such a trivial problem, but I just felt surrounded and backed into a corner. Just having someone in the world saying "You didn't ruin their lives by asking them to keep it down" helps so much, because that is what it seemed like at the time, even though in my heart of hearts I didn't think I'd done anything quite *so* terrible.

Symora I'm glad you escaped your bad marriage. I'm not ready for that yet. I know it's vexing to you all to read my letters and nothing much has changed, but I don't know where I'd be without this place, seriously... it's melodramatic but I went from feeling universally condemned and feeling suicidal to believing I was okay again!

I'm too sensitive, and am surrounded by people who are very much NOT sensitive, but robust and sanguine (for the most part). They don't understand me at all, and it really makes life difficult for us. This is what makes me think I should just go away and leave them alone. When you're just basically incompatible, what can you do? Nothing ever feels right, ever, you can never relax.

Interesting to note this guy and my hubby seem a lot alike, the way they twist my words to seem unfriendly and then punish me for it. But is there that much bad luck? How can it be that I've got two men around like this? So it's hard to believe it's not actually my fault.

Anyway, thank you again!!

[Symora]

Hi JaneE, I want you to know that by no means was I urging you to leave your husband, or anything of the kind.... I never would have left I think, it ends up he left me for another woman in the end and boy did that reinforce the unworthyness!!! What I was trying to say is that when we live with people who demean us on a regular basis, we often end up believing what they say at a deep level. Intellectually we may know that they are wrong, but it gets into our psyche and then we start being our own internal 'tormentor', taking on their language and put downs and making it our own, falsely.

I found it made me crazy... Inside I knew who I was, and I knew I was not a bad person. But my father, and then my husband, who both had bad tempers and mean mouths would tell me I was like this and like that, and I would wonder if maybe they were right, and then I would get all confused inside. It eventually led to depression, thoughts of suicide, low self-esteem. Even after I divorced, it too me years to unravel all of that crap and figure out that I was not who they said I was. Now 20 years later I can clearly see that my X is a conman and knows exactly what to do to manipulate and control others. With me it was demeaning words, and it worked very well to manipulate me so that he would get his way in the end... as soon as I started to question my worth and the value of my needs, he had me ...

I guess I'm just trying to say that I understand where you're coming from, and to encourage you to remain steadfast in valuing yourself, your needs and your concerns. You have value too!

[Someguy]

See, this is what abusive people do. They make you feel as though it's your fault if you don't abide by their wishes....even when they are clearly being abusive and inappropriate themselves.

I don't believe in moderate or demure behavior when you encounter this.

I believe what abusive people do is not only not respect your boundaries, but they actually break them down and trespass all over your sense of self worth and your rights as an individual.....they're usually chronic cranks. Very sinister people.

I believe if you feel demeaned and tormented, you'll have to act upon it, because to a certain extent that's what these narcissistic alcoholic sociopaths expect you to do. Abusive people love confrontation. They're drama seeking self centered individuals who have no respect for being at peace with themselves or being at peace with others.

[JaneE]

Symora, Oh no I didn't think you were trying to get me to leave or anything, but I know it's frustrating for friends and acquaintances to see people in my situation who seem to be doing nothing about it. ^^;; I lost my best friend this way. She just couldn't deal with it. I don't blame her! Yikes, my man hasn't left me for another woman, but early on in our relationship he was still too involved with his ex-wife. That was hard! She finally got a restraining order against him.

Someguy, You know you're so right about abusers seeking/wanting conflict. I mean, it makes a lot of sense!! I think they tend to be those chronically understimulated types who have to make their lives more interesting than I am comfortable with! XD

I dream of winning the lottery and buying my own house! One with lots of room between it and the neighbors, lol!

[David O]

Hi Jane,

I recall from your very first post here, the struggles you were experiencing. Then as now, you couldn't leave your husband for very real reasons and not just, as many will assume, because you choose to stay.

You'll find much support, understanding, compassion and encouragement here, as you already have-- and my heart goes out to you as I know this a most painful and eviscerating experience. I've been in hundreds of abusive situations as a child, and am the survivor of 1000's of incidents of severe abuse, molestation, torture and trauma... some of which still haunt me 50+ years later.

I have to say that I agree with Someguy, who in a very strong, self empowering way, is suggesting something that needs to be said. Jane, to be honest, you trained him to treat you this way, as he trained you to treat him as you do. You trained him, whether he came into the relationship as abusive or not, whether by default or not, whether by being complicit or not, to treat you like chattel... like a non-being, a piece of disposable furniture, something to be abused at his whim. This, I suspect, has come about, over time, as a result of your Avoidant Personality Disorder.

From the perspective of bullying and abusive relationships, you are 1/2 of the equation-- he is the bully and you're the provacateur in his eyes. This in no way excuses his behavior, but what it does do is point out your role and highlights how you contribute to the damaging exchanges. And while you can't control him, you can control you and make behavioral changes that will force him to adjust. If your physical vulnerability limits your capacity to make these behavioral changes, then we need to discuss other options that won't leave you high and dry (I don't want to forget this aspect of your relationship).

Until you accept this and are willing to look at this from this perspective, you'll continue t suffer needlessly. The question then becomes one of how long do you want this to continue? We had some strategies in an earlier thread which would have started you on the path to self empowerment, did you follow them for at least 2-3 months. They were your ticket to self empowerment, self determination and self responsibility. Did you follow through on them as we had discussed?

Please understand that my intent is not to be insensitive, lacking understanding or callousness, or to simply point the finger at you .. in reality, it is compassion, depth of understanding and empathy that require this response.

Please consider this and write back,

David

[Someguy]

I'm serious about calling the cops.

If your neighbors love their bling blings like you said, the last thing they'll want to do is jeopardize losing their material possessions. Putting somebody in jail for a couple of months has a tendency of doing that. They may not give a rat's behind about you, but I'm sure once it gets in their heads they might lose all their possessions, they'll do a complete 180 in their behavior.

Narcissists have a tendency to love things more then people.

[Guest ASchwartz]

Hi JaneE,

I want to join the chorus of people who are expressing support for you. In fact, there was nothing wrong with but everything right with your asking the neighbors to lower the music. And yes, your husband should have been fully supportive of you. In fact, what is wrong with him? Is it always like this? His wife was insulted. He should have come to your immediated defense and demanded an apology.

But, there is a deeper question and message in all of this:

When confronted by these ugly types of situations, and they happen to all of us sometimes, why do you blame yourself? Why do you believe you were wrong and why do they make you want to die? And, by the way, this is not trivial, not in the least. But, by saying it is trivial you are again trying to reduce yourself. Why?

Please think about these questions. I am curious about the answers after you have thought about it, but, answering is up to you, of course.

Allan:)

[mscat]

Hi JaneE,

You had every right to ask the neighbors to turn down their music. you did nothing wrong. Your h usband should have been supportive of you, not further treated you like crap, and helped you think you were the one who did something wrong.

the neighbor sounds like a angry drunk , and think he has every right to do whatever he wants , esp. after he is smashed. I would have caled the cops, would not even opened the door, if he came over like that.

your not a bad person at all, Jane. What I have noticed is that their are a lot of people out there that are very rude, direspectful and hold little regard for anyone but themselves.

Please do not take it personally. these are in no way your fault.

[Guest Star9DeAtH9wIsH]

I'm tired of being such a failure. I can't make it work with people. I try, I really really try but it always ends up people screaming "F*CK YOU" in my face. Literally.

Like tonight. My neighbors were having a party. They don't do it super often, they've gotten better, and only once before have I asked them to please keep it down. Tonight I did too. Our houses are very close together. VERY close, like 10ft apart! They play LOUD music, like walls shaking (MINE that is), thumping you can feel down the street loud music! I'm in my bedroom, MY PERSONAL SPACE. And it's like they're there too! Not fun... it just doesn't seem right or fair to me.

So I put on my robe and walked over to my neighbors and asked them to please keep it down. The girlfriend was polite and said "I'm sorry" and I came home. Next thing I know the boyfriend is banging on my door... and yelling "F*CK YOU" in my face about my asking him to turn their music down. Yes he's drunk.

Then I get a harangue from my husband about what a jerk I am! Who do I think I am asking people to turn their music down? I get to hear about what a "blobstrop face" I am etc. He's often verbally abusive to me anyway, so of course I got no support and he didn't defend me to the neighbor at all!!

I'm seriously bewildered though. Why is what I did such a crime??? I didn't tell them they couldn't listen to any music at all. I didn't say I was calling the cops, I didn't yell "F*CK YOU!" I didn't say they can't have parties or whatever... I really tried my best to be polite!!!!! All I asked them to do was to please keep it down! It was 11:30 at night!

Lately I cannot do anything right. All I hear about is what a jerk I am all the time. I just want to be alone. I try so hard!!!! But I always always fail.

Yesterday my family was out for the day and i had time alone. ALL DAY!! It was SO NICE. Nobody looking over my shoulder and criticizing me, nobody telling me what a jerk I am because I didn't respond to something the "right" way, nobody second-guessing me, nobody telling me my "perceptions are wrong", nobody getting mad at me. God, it was so... *blissful* I just did my work, cleaned up the house... the kinds of things people do, and I felt so weightless!

Then today happened. I'm so tired of this world. I'm so tired of myself and my inability to get along with anyone??? It seems? I think of suicide. Intellectually I know I should die. That wherever I go I'll still be a personality disorder (avoidant) that can't get along. Who says the wrong kinds of things at the wrong time and is never never forgiven for it, who is shunned. I like life... I don't want to die... but I can't make anything work, and I'm soo soooo tired of people screaming "F*CK YOU" in my face, literally and figuratively. I'm so tired of being made out to be the bad guy in my family, the odd one out who is necessarily always wrong... tired of people being angry with me all the time. I wish I had the guts to hang myself. They'd all be so much happier without me around, and the world would have one less defective human cluttering it up for the nice normal people who think it's their god-given right to impose their noise on others in their beds late at night.

I NEVER NEVER do that to them, have NEVER done so! When we have parties I'm careful that they're not noisy. We even have music, but not at outdoor concert decibel levels...!

Ack, sorry for going on. I'm still shaking like a leaf. I feel like the whole world condemns me. Maybe they should. Maybe tomorrow the neighbor will come over and apologize. I'd totally forgive him, too!! But will I be forgiven, or even understood? I really really doubt it. I just want to bury myself in a hole and never see another human ever again.

Anyone else have this problem?? ^^:;

no but sort of its more of someone i know problem that happens to them a lot lol

but i get it!

[JaneE]

Hi, Sorry for taking so long to get back to you. I was in the middle of replying once before but got interrupted.

Allan asked why do I blame myself? Well because of my disorder, my "Flawed Perceptions". I cannot ever be confident that I'm in the right. I go by my feelings, and try to go by what I know (I read a lot so I have a good idea of what's right by this late age of 43) so I *think* I'm right enough, but yeah. Ultimately I know I'm flawed and disordered and I feel in the wrong.

DavidO asked (I think) if I'd read that book he prescribed before, about "7 steps to saving your marriage" or something. I haven't managed to get it, so no...! I don't get out much, and am not alone often, so it's not like I can just go out and buy some book easily. I should order it online I guess, but I haven't done it yet. Maybe I feel passive-aggressive and not so motivated because it's a book on "improving my marriage". I don't actually have one, as it happens. I'm not legally married! Of course that's irrelevant. I call him husband he calls me wife, even if there isn't a state-approved certificate saying 'Yeah you are'. I have a lot of issues about the whole concept of "marriage" and my general failure as "woman". I don't cook, I'm not that nurturing, and I'm totally asocial, except online where I can TYPE my words, and SEE them, and not lose my train of thought through fear. The marriage book should help me. I do want to read it. But so far I haven't got it yet.

But of course that's all beside the point. The point is making it work, right? I am doing my best, and doing my best to overlook the callous bits, like when he doesn't wait for me but goes into a building and doesn't hold the door, but lets it slam in my face. ^^;;

>_< I guess I'm supposed to "TRAIN" him to behave properly, rather than let him have trained me to accept such discourtesy?

And this evening I was defending kids of illegal immigrants who do well and want to be allowed to stay. I contrast it with my native-born experience. Me, a gormless piece of human garbage who is worthless, compared to someone who was dragged here as a kid, navigated the system SUCCESSFULLY and has a FUTURE (and probably a normal personality!!)!!! Please! Send me to Peru in his place!!! lol Or Haiti, Or Africa!

Anyway, none of this may seem like a proper answer, but I think maybe someone will understand! I'm trying, but I need to try harder, I know!

Thanks again, for your kind and thoughtful responses!

Jane

[Guest ASchwartz]

Hi Jane,

No, your perceptions aren't flawed, only your thinking. You need to work on the thoughts you give yourself rather than your perceptions. In fact, thinking that your perceptions are flawed is a good example of thinking that upsets you.

Allan:)

[ttjack]

whoa jane.... seriously... whoa lets take a step back...

you go over to ask someone to turn down the music, some jerkoff comes over after a girl was polite with you and tells you, "F*CK YOU" and you question yourself about who you are as a person??????????

first off... where was your husband at to hand this guy a beat down? you said your family so I assume you are married... as a man thats not to be tolerated.

second this guy is a jerk off and not worth your inner self-hate cause you couldn't get a positive response from some drunk punk moron being a retard.

don't let that jerkoff get in your head like that.

sorry but that guy sounds like a complete freak and it pisses me off that he pulled that crap because look what it did to your feelings. what a loser.

[Jetliner]

..........

[Endure]

Wow Jane, you sure are a patient and tolerant person, if my neighbours had loud music on that late at night I would have totaly lost the plot and especially if he had come and sworn at me I would make him regret it. The only thing you did wrong was not to call the cops and make a complaint both about the music and about the abusive language from your drunk neighbour..

[lise001]

Can I add as the accused 'abuser' after 15 years of marriage and 2 children, that living with a man who is silent and doesn't express any feelings at all, be it positive or negative, can cripple a person and a marriage.

It got to the point where I believed that nothing I did was right - in the bedroom or out of it. I just assumed that nothing I did made him happy. I couldn't even bring any of this to his attention because he would simply not respond (avoidance) and it was impossible to have a fight with him because he would retreat.

I felt totally unloved and uncared for and reacted badly. I saw what he was doing to me and subsequently his children as being 'abusive', and in it's own way, it is.

I am not the same outgoing girl he married, and have lost all my spark, optimism and sense of humour - it is a very dark place to be. And, yes, he has told me over and over again that he never thought I would have anything to do with, let alone marry him. SO WHY DID HE ASK ME OUT IN THE FIRST PLACE?

Living with and marrying an avoidant can take you to a very dark place, simply because you have no understanding of what you are dealing with. The silences and retreating are crippling and make you question everything about yourself that you once thought was good and worthwhile. I know, I am in that place now.

So, please, there are always two sides to a story and I know how much pain my husband's lies, stories and fantasies have caused us both.

Thank you for listening.

[Symora]

Hi Lise, welcome. I'm sorry that your marriage has been so difficult for you, and I can understand that being treated in a dismissive way can be very painful. I have lived that to a degree as well and I know how it can affect one's sense of self. Do you have other people in your life who offer you more support and comfort?

[JaneE]

Hi Lise!

You know, a lot of the things you said I can relate to... I feel the same way about never doing or saying the right thing for my husband, and wondering what he ever saw in me.

It's a bit upsetting to me that you seem to be assuming I am uncommunicative and unemotional in my relationship (because I'm avoidant) and so is your husband and he's this way to you. In your first sentence you said you are labeled an "abuser"? My husband is often abusive to me. And I've also been told this is my fault on various levels and in various ways.

But anyway! I hope you find help here, and I hope you and your husband can get into therapy and work some issues out.

I haven't been around much lately, but welcome to the forum :-)

Jane

[Jetliner]

..........

[JaneE]

Well the disorder I'm referring to is my diagnosis of Avoidant PD. So I *know* my thinking is flawed on some level, and that I have to be extra careful. I did feel very much in the right in this, and I stood up for myself. I didn't think I was asking anything unreasonable AT ALL!! I was shocked and horrified at the reaction I got, and the way my husband failed to defend me, it was a real crisis to feel "everyone" against me. Luckily I had the very sane and sensible people here to say I wasn't being crazy in asking the neighbors to cool it a bit at 11:30pm. lol

Recently my husband was blabbing on his cell phone downstairs. He was really yelling into the thing (the way people often do). Our house has very thin walls and floors and I went down and asked him "can you *please* lower your voice?" I was a little exasperated, but not angry or anything, and things had been well between us lately. Do you know what he did? Hi FLIPPED ME OFF! I was so shocked. I went up to him and said quietly but firmly: "that was not necessary" He started saying "F*ck you" and "C*nt" and so forth. In front of a business associate!! Verbally abusing me, in front of a business associate!!! >_<

So you see what I'm up against.... I just happen to live in a place where people take it badly if I ask them to not be noisy. I don't get it, but oh well. I don't get a lot of things!!

[silentmist]

Whoa ... does that kinda outburst happen often ?