How important is sex to a marriage?

[Perseverance]

"Accepting your size" means accepting that you could be her "best", even if you're not her biggest. It's that simple.

It all hinges around your definition of what "best" means, or what it means to "please her most". And her still being with you suggests that she thinks you're her idea of "best".

Best means best feeling PIV intercourse. Everything else can be worked on. I still sit here clueless if I've ever noticed her orgasm by the way. She says she does but I would think something would change. Orgasms are noticeable aren't they? I have given girls orgasms before. It's very noticeable.

[malign]

Not every woman even has vaginal orgasms. They're just like us: they're all different.

The only reliable way I know of to find out if a woman is satisfied is to ask her, and trust what she tells you.

[JaiJai]

?........

[Perseverance]

Not every woman even has vaginal orgasms. They're just like us: they're all different.

The only reliable way I know of to find out if a woman is satisfied is to ask her, and trust what she tells you.

I know that. But she's not big on oral sex or clitoral stimulation. You would think a girl who doesn't have vaginal orgasms would go that route?

[malign]

You might. But again, you'd be a guy guessing what his girl likes, instead of just listening to her.

On this site, I have heard more than enough stories of how different people's behaviors are, not even including how trauma or bad habits or whatever might modify those behaviors ... There are people who are disgusted by sex; there are people who are uninterested in sex; there are people who prefer sheep. It's too big a world to try to guess.

Your only real option is to trust her. Or not. And if you find you can't, you have the option to try to explore why not. I'm going to guess that has more to do with your life history than hers.

[Perseverance]

You might. But again, you'd be a guy guessing what his girl likes, instead of just listening to her.

On this site, I have heard more than enough stories of how different people's behaviors are, not even including how trauma or bad habits or whatever might modify those behaviors ... There are people who are disgusted by sex; there are people who are uninterested in sex; there are people who prefer sheep. It's too big a world to try to guess.

Your only real option is to trust her. Or not. And if you find you can't, you have the option to try to explore why not. I'm going to guess that has more to do with your life history than hers.

I can ask. Then again I come off insecure. It never works out when I ask.

[malign]

Well, let's face it: you are, on this particular topic, insecure.

Listening to her could mean listening to the message you're already getting without asking: she's with you, not someone else. That's not the only problem you face, though, given that you're also unsatisfied with her lack of interest in sex in general. If you're not in a position to talk about those things with her, perhaps they're addressable with a therapist, either by yourself or with her. Or you could try to accept the situation, which you seem to be trying with limited success. Or, you could try someone else.

And I only list all the options, including those I think are unlikely, because it's when we think there are no options that things start to really hurt.

[Jessie]

What do you mean by "deformed"? Is it a matter of shape, function, or both? If you posted about this before, please point me to the thread.

shape and size

[Jessie]

WHAT!!???? HOW CAN THIS BE???!!! A TABLOID PRINTED SOMETHING INSENSITIVE AHD UNKIND!!!???

Whoa. Shocker.

Well. Thank goodness you base important decisions like your entire self worth on such scientific and scholarly articles.

I have clinical studies and surveys and articles if you want JaiJai, I can show you graphs and tables to your hearts content....

I used the tabloid quotes as it illustrates the kind of thing I have heard and the modern mind set of the women in our lives.

[malign]

Jess, there is a point to the idea that all those studies and things that you have are things that you, with whatever biases you might have, chose to collect. Even assuming that "quotes that are findable on the internet" represented an unbiased source, it's hard to eliminate the bias of the collector.

[Jessie]

Thats sarcasm....not laughter. and the point is, very rarely is anything actually true in a tabloid. are they real people? did they disclose their names? there is no evidence that tom and chuck from accounting didnt make up the conversation. it certainly doesnt read like any natural conversation women would have about a topic they knew was being printed.

If you want to base your beliefs on something, for gods sake, find something credible.

Oh sorry...let me rephrase it more delicately....

Do you think it would be helpful, and possibly more acurate, if you used many sources for your information, preferably some with a reputation for integrity, before drawing conclusions. Try to keep an open mind! Its quite typical of someone with this sort of belief about themself to only pay attention to articles that confirm their beliefs...even when it comes from a source that is highly questionable...like a tabloid.

Yes they are true with names and their home towns and in some cases their uni and course of study.

This street survey has been done for over a decade with that publication.

I would give you a link but I think thats inappropriate on this site.

There are many other sources of info- this is just one of many many others.

[Jessie]

Jess, there is a point to the idea that all those studies and things that you have are things that you, with whatever biases you might have, chose to collect. Even assuming that "quotes that are findable on the internet" represented an unbiased source, it's hard to eliminate the bias of the collector.

i know there is biased intrepretation of many things but can I really misintrpet those clips I posted or the quotes I posted?

Did I really imagine the cinema audiences revulsion at the small dick in that film I saw in the summer?

[malign]

Yes, you really can misinterpret the things you have posted. You're not interpreting them as the opinion of the individuals, but as the opinion of masses.

My guess is that the only opinions that really matter to you are the ones you've met. The rest is just to keep yourself from trying again.

[Jessie]

Its true that the opinion of the women in my life are of the most paramount importance.

Alas all such women have either said size does matter or if they said it didn't, gave so many caveats that in fact it DID matter (really, deep down)

'unless they are very undersized or deformed'- isnt that was Jai Jai said?

Well I'm on the verge of micro and have a malformation.

Perhaps I am on the wrong site- I am really really in a difficult position- you wouldnt beleive the faces of a couple of the genuinely nice girls I have been with when they saw me.

But there are guys much bigger than me- that also are not 'delusional'- many uk women simply will not contemplate 5 inches for example- I mean 'will not contemplate'.

We are not talking about a tiny minority of size queens by the way- they are out of the questioj obviously- I am talking about MOST women... a sod it Im back to black....... on a loop.. sorry

[malign]

The real question is whether, when a guy encounters a girl who "won't contemplate" his penis, he's required to take that as his problem and not hers.

But Jess, no one denies that you're in a difficult position, seriously. We are still exploring why you're in that position and how you might get relief from it.

It's good to recognize that you're looping, because if that's unacceptable to you, you can use that perception to help you break out of the loop, even if it's only enough to get help to see why the loop exists. It doesn't exist because of "them" out there; it exists in your thinking because you've taken it in, inside of you.

[Jessie]

I know I shouldnt take either rejection or others comments to heart-

and Im old enough to know that life dishes out different experiences to different people- I know Santa doesnt exist and that not all of us get to have true love or lasting love.

A cylist in london got killed this morning- I know life is tough and it certainly aint fair.

The thing is- going back to your 1st line... this is never a girls problem (at least unless they are with us) ... they simply find a normal guy instead... (I guess I would in their shoes).

its MY problem cos its attached to my body and there is no cure. Im stuck with it.

And my 'loop' is due to my size and peoples reaction to it. Ultimatley I can change neither...

[IrmaJean]

Wouldn't you want to be with a woman who thinks of and respects you as a person and human being , though, Jessie? Whenever I read the quotes you post, I personally find the dialogue of the women very insensitive and disrespectful. Perhaps a woman who was caring and respectful would not be talking to such a magazine.

Take care.

[JaiJai]

?.........

[Wutty3]

The tally:

It doesn’t matter as long as it’s not too big or too small:21

It doesn’t matter at all:23

The bigger, the better: 6

The first tally (It doesn't matter as long as...)=21... Might as well be saying it matters.

The second tally (It doesn't matter at all)= 23... YAY There is some hope.

The third tally (the bigger the better) =6... Well what can I say...That's what we are here for. To try to accept this reality.

Total

It matters 27(That damned AS LONG AS...changed the totals)

It doesn't matter 23 (There's hope for us yet.)

Not trying to rain on anyone's parade JaiJai but even according to the survey you posted the majority say that size matters in one way or another. I did notice that there was no tally for "smaller is better". That's to be expected though.

[mts]

=-

[JaiJai]

?..........

[Jessie]

Hi

Jai Jai- you were not being tactless at all- you are very kind, logical and sensitive.

However (oh yeah- there is always a however) I have quoted the 50 quote thing myself.

I actually counted 10 truly 'doesnt matter comments'- (ie no caveats or contradictions).

so thats 80% of women think it matters in extremes and I am in the extreme.

But those women MIGHT have been a bit circumspect due to them realising it was going to be published- I suspect the true % is higher than 80% for 'it matters'

I know you will say "you are biased Jessie" but read the sentences carefully- Im actually being quite impartial.

And if its say 90% you may say 10% is loads.... but that 10% of the possible women that may find you attractive and that are single and that you meet- now you are down to less than 1%.

None of my 5 partners could cope with my size- maybe if I slept with 100 women I may end up with a girl that really didnt mind- but could I cope with 99 rejections?

I dunno that I could, to be honest- thats weak- I know- but least its honest.

[Perseverance]

I'd say 30 pounds changes nothing for the majority of men. Lol. Most of my friends love girls with a little weight on them. Chicks can get away with being fat as long as it's not the "giving up" kinda fat.

[malign]

The way I see it, the issue of weight for women does capture a portion of this problem. Sure, in theory they could just lose the weight and the issue goes away, but I don't suspect they put on weight deliberately, so that might be easier said than done. They (certain women) may feel that it's irreversible, wouldn't consider or be able to afford surgery, whatever.

So, what matters is that, in the woman's mind, she's overweight, won't be able to change, will be ridiculed by most men, and is unacceptable to them sexually. It isn't important (to her) that she might be mistaken about any part of that. She believes it, may have had some experience with one or more men who confirmed portions of her belief, and now gives up on her life because she feels that she'll never be able to enjoy sex, feel feminine, or have confidence in interactions with others. Weight, after all, unlike penis size, is visible all the time ...

Whereas it is possible that, as Perse says, most (by some definition of most) men won't care. It's possible that, seen from outside, the woman's obsession with her weight, which she can confirm "matters" easily in many places on the web, is misguided and excessive.

So, who is "right"? Hopefully, we're not engaged in a competition about whose suffering is "more". And I do feel, from experiences here on this site, that helping others with their problems quite often leads to unexpected insights into our own. Just another reason why I encourage guys to read posts outside of this forum as well ...

[mts]

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