Nothing has changed

[a_mess]

Haven't been here for a while. I thought id take a break cause i thought talkin about it all the time was makin me worse. I would love to know where all these women are that supposedly think 5 1/2 is fine cause i'm so sick of being ridiculed about something i cant change. All I know is i really need someone, im so sick of bein alone. How is everyone else doin?

[flander]

Nothing has really changed for me either. My ex tried to give me dating advice, which was kinda strange. My neighbor's girlfriend still wakes me up at times with her damn moaning and screaming at all hours of the night. Most of the time the weather radio drowns it out, but if there's nothing being broadcast, it turns off.

[lifeless existence]

Same as always. Lonely. Depressed. Sick and tired of being small. Even more sick and tired of being regarded as inadequate because of something I didn't ask for and can't change. Angry at the world. Bitter. Jealous. Hostile. Full of hate. Just another day in the life of a small guy. I rarely post anymore myself. It doesn't make a bit of difference. There's no escape from being trapped by this particular curse.

[Athena]

Honestly guys - are women really that shallow? Personally, I value kindness, compassion, generosity, trustworthiness, strength of character, a good sense of humor, self-sufficiency and a regard for others' feelings way ahead of penis size. Of course, I have to be attracted to the guy physically, but unless you guys are hanging out (pardon the pun) at nudist camps, your "size" is NOT what women notice first.

Did you know the majority of female orgasms come from the stimulation of the clitoris? Makes sense - it's like an itty bitty penis. OK, penetration adds emotionally and perhaps physically from a secondary standpoint, but size is not a big deal. I hear some women are turned on by a guy's big toe!

I can understand how it must feel if a girl laughs at you over your size. Sounds incredibly cruel. Perhaps you can use it as a screening tool. Kind of like if a guy flinches because I want to put a condom on him. Sorry bub, you just failed the screen if you don't care about my welfare.

What if you just keep the lights out? Maybe they won't notice.

Sorry if I barged in on the "men's" club. Just thought you might not mind hearing a woman's opinion.

[IrmaJean]

I'm sorry that some of you are still struggling. My thought is that any of you deserve to be seen, loved and appreciated exactly as you are. I hope that you will keep trying.

[LonelyGuy]

Nothing has changed for me either

[a_mess]

No you didn't barge in at all. I for one apprieciate your comment. I know women like you are out there but just been hurt too many times to try again......Thank you for your post

[Athena]

Glad you appreciated it. You sound kind of like me in the reverse, ie: recently i kept saying "all men are jerks". (i'm in the middle of a drawn out divorce, and most people who know my ex call him a total jerk). Well, actually I said something worse than "jerks" but I don't feel like repeating that here. Anyway, your beliefs have a habit of proving you right. Every article you see in the newspaper, or a magazine, or story somebody tells you about how awful a particular woman was just serves to prove you right. So try seeking out positive articles and stories and maybe you will find there are many more nice women than you thought. It's not very motivating thinking you are looking for 1 in a hundred. I know, I'm trying to get out of that headspace.

PS: I love the names you guys come up with - a_mess, lifelessexistence. That's how I was feeling when I first stumbled across this thread so I just had to check it out. Kind of makes you feel like you are not alone.

[flander]

IMHO, most of the good ones are taken by now.

[Athena]

IMHO, most of the good ones are taken by now.

That's exactly how I feel. I guess as long as equal numbers of men and women say that, that in itself should give us hope, should it not?

[randomperson]

Interesting Athena, think you hit on something. Honestly I came in here because of the thread topic.. it relates to so many of us in this community. But I am glad I did.. I too feel the same way that all the good women are taken.

What you said though Athena gives me hope, maybe it is more of a mindset.

Personally being a virgin only kissing a woman once I have never encountered situations like mentioned, however I do know more than enough about the pains of rejection and how shallow and cruel some people can be both men and women.

For the guys on here for me I encounter the same things you mentioned and it isn't because of size. I think Athena is right perception is everything. As I felt just like everyone else, asking where all the good mates are.

I have browsed many topics on the board and almost all of us relate so closely. We all feel lost, hurt, confused and alone. I think the key is to love ourselves for who we are and to be happy with life as it is. To not hinge our happiness on others as people are wild cards and unpredictable.

I say this and figured this out about a half year ago.. but I have yet to find how to make this happen in my own life. But I deeply want to. I want to be happy with life as is, be happy alone if needed.

[Athena]

I have browsed many topics on the board and almost all of us relate so closely. We all feel lost, hurt, confused and alone. I think the key is to love ourselves for who we are and to be happy with life as it is. To not hinge our happiness on others as people are wild cards and unpredictable.

I say this and figured this out about a half year ago.. but I have yet to find how to make this happen in my own life. But I deeply want to. I want to be happy with life as is, be happy alone if needed.

For some reason, earlier today I was compelled to look up quotes by Mother Teresa. Here is one that your comments brought to mind: "Loneliness and the feeling of being unwanted is the most terrible poverty." I don't think it is actually possible to be completely alone and happy. That doesn't necessarily mean you must have an intimate relationship to be happy (look at MoIther Teresa!) But you do need love in your heart and that I think is impossible if you don't love yourself. And therein lies the challenge. If you have felt second rate or unworthy of others' love for your entire life, how do you change this feeling? I think that is where we need help.

For me, psychotherapy was eye opening. Perhaps I am lucky to have had such a profound experience in my first two weeks with my current therapist (of course that was after searching for an entire year for the right one). Two weeks (4x/wk) of being listened to, understood, not judged, "seen", empathized with and cared about gave me such an intense emotional connection to my therapist that it changed everything. I was more loving to my kids, I laughed more, my negative thought patterns virtually disappeared, I went up to people more, joked with them more and for the first time in my life, i felt like I wasn't dead. I had a massive amount of energy and motivation and my hands (which are usually freezing) were all of a sudden warm.

Unfortunately, the connection has faded - I suspect it will ebb and flow - but I now understand the one huge element that was missing from my life. All of a sudden, I felt good about myself, and that made me connect better with others. Outside of therapy, I think that charitable work might give a person that sense of self worth, but for me, I am a bundle of defense mechanisms, so I need somebody to help me get rid of those before I can truly have healthy lasting relationships.

I also think this place helps a lot. In many ways, I feel more connected to people here than I do in the "non internet" world.

So, I guess I'm agreeing with you, the first step is to love yourself. But I don't think you can survive if you suffer from unrelenting loneliness. The good thing is, I don't think you will suffer loneliness anymore once you figure the first part out.

[Recluse]

It is interesting how I am absolutely right about the girth situation. I noticed earlier in this thread that one of the women posted they notice girth before length. Proves my point, as long as you have girth you are ok, if you don't, like myself, you are fucked. For those of you who have adequate girth, stop worrying about the length, that is not as important.

I don't post much here anymore either. It won't change my situation.

[flander]

Honestly guys - are women really that shallow? Personally, I value kindness, compassion, generosity, trustworthiness, strength of character, a good sense of humor, self-sufficiency and a regard for others' feelings way ahead of penis size. Of course, I have to be attracted to the guy physically, but unless you guys are hanging out (pardon the pun) at nudist camps, your "size" is NOT what women notice first.

Can you honestly say that you would be content with someone that at best, you could only barely feel? I doubt it.

That's exactly how I feel. I guess as long as equal numbers of men and women say that, that in itself should give us hope, should it not?

No. That would just mean an equal number admit how rotten their locality is. The probability that one is not in the set of "the good ones" as viewed by members of the opposite sex is still high.

[IrmaJean]

Flander, in honesty I'm pretty certain that my spouse is not much different from most of you, and I assure you that I feel penetration just fine. It is not something that I have ever given a second thought but to accept as part of him. I wouldn't want him any different. I want him to be him. That is the beauty of it. The act itself is about sharing. The sharing is what makes it special, not any specific dimensions. I would always view that as a honor and never something to judge. There must be many other women who feel as I do about this.

[Athena]

Recluse, Flander;

I totally agree with IrmaJean. THE most important thing is about sharing. Also, showing the woman you care about her. Making her feel special. For me, that would be taking me out to a nice restaurant, or taking me out to a concert or a show. Chivalry is not dead - I still appreciate a guy letting me out of the elevator first, opening the car door for me, giving me their jacket if I'm cold. For others, it could be something totally different. Finding out what your woman likes will go a long way with her. I think that putting her needs first will also help you from being so self conscious. I've discovered recently that being outwardly directed naturally makes you more approachable to others.

I really want to help you guys out here but I feel like I'm walking on eggshells. In terms of the "physical feeling" side of things, the emotional connection has a huge impact. You could be the size of a cucumber, but if the woman doesn't have the emotional connection with you, it won't do any good, in fact, it might even be physically painful for her. Also, i read somewhere that the majority of women do not experience orgasm through penetration, but rather through other methods (personally, I am in this camp). Learning about a woman's body would probably give you a huge advantage over other guys. There's lots of stuff on the Internet. I found a site you may find helpful, I'm not sure if I'm brave enough to post it in this thread. You can pm me if you'd like me to send it.

Finally, I could take the comment that "all the good ones are taken" as a personal insult. I won't though, because I'm single and perfect. Except for the fact that I'm neurotic, BPD, self conscious, usually depressed, have a SI habit, have two kids and can't/won't have any more, am going insane from never ending divorce proceedings and am pushing 50.:eek:

[miller72]

Hi Athena,

Curious, what is an SI problem?

I have to agree with the other guys, this is one thing that will never go away. I'm getting old enough now that I don't care about sex as much as used to, but in a way that makes it worse. I have to live the rest of my life knowing what I missed out on. I'll never know what its like to have a woman go "whoa" and see lust in her eyes.

It is impossible to escape. Just the other day an ad came on the radio for a home store. It was filled with reference to penis size - a wife calls the store complaining that her neighbors "snowblower" is bigger than her husbands, what can she do to solve this problem, etc etc.

I'm sick of it. None of us asked to be born this way. Our problem is in our heads - we love women so much, the thought of most women seeing us an inadequate is too hard to take. It has caused me a case of severe depression, addictions, no confidence in the workplace, anger, hostility, etc. Knowing there is not a damn thing we can do about it. Whenever women try to convince us otherwise, its always in terms of "size doesn't matter IF we love him, or IF he's good at other things, or IF he's a good dad, husband, whatever.

The fact remains if there was someone walking around exactly like me in all things except size, a woman will always choose bigger. I'd rather be dead.

M72

[IrmaJean]

It's good to hear from you, Miller. I'm sorry things haven't improved for you. Why not turn your focus to those who will appreciate and accept you rather than giving power to those who don't?

The fact remains if there was someone walking around exactly like me in all things except size, a woman will always choose bigger.

There is no way for you to know what every woman would choose. You are deciding for yourself, ahead of time.

Size doesn't matter to me. It is not something I would think about or even consider. I'm sure there must be many women in the world who feel as I do.

I hope you feel better, Miller.

SI is an abbreviation for self-injury.

[Athena]

M72,

Once again, I totally agree with IJ. And I think as women get older, we learn what is really important in a relationship, and it is definitely NOT size. It's not like we are dating a bunch of guys at the same time and "picking" one.

Unfortunately I feel like this is landing on deaf ears for three reasons. One - a woman can't possibly truly understand what you are going through. OK, I'll give you that one. Two - when you are in so much emotional pain, feel empty, one of the walking dead, utterly hopeless, persecuted, and completely worthless, you distrust and perhaps even direct rage at those who are genuinely trying to help you (I understand this one well, this describes me three months ago.) and Three - You appear to be using a defense mechanism called "splitting" which you use to protect yourself from further pain. You believe that all women are going to judge you, based on your prior experience. I'm also an expert at "splitting", although for a different issue. Unfortunately, your extreme belief can become a self fulfilling prophesy. So, the best thing would be to try to reverse it, or at least not encourage it. The danger of being on a forum like this is that the vast majority of men posting here are still suffering from your issue. Therefore, you are going to hear way more stories that "prove" your belief that all women are judgemental. Maybe you should seek out inspiring true stories of people who find their true love at your age.

[Athena]

A thought just popped into my head and I had to just get it down before I forgot it. It is: If size matters, how come there are so many lesbians out there?

(IrmaJean, if you think this comment is going to offend, please delete it)

[flander]

Emotional connection is fine and dandy until she gets fed up with having to pretend and wants to be like her friends who actually enjoy sex. That's when the cheating starts and if the guy is lucky, he won't have a legal system financially raping him for the next decade or two once she leaves.

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

I think it would generally be a good idea for people here to make clearer distinctions between the things they've actually experienced and what they think likely to happen.

Also I wonder if there is a way a woman could leave you that wouldn't make you assume it's because of your penis size.

[flander]

Also, i read somewhere that the majority of women do not experience orgasm through penetration, but rather through other methods (personally, I am in this camp). Learning about a woman's body would probably give you a huge advantage over other guys. There's lots of stuff on the Internet.

A thought just popped into my head and I had to just get it down before I forgot it. It is: If size matters, how come there are so many lesbians out there?

I know what you're getting at, but given my bottom lip sticks out more than my tongue, she would still be better off taking care of herself.

It sucks to stumble across blog posts like this:

You ever get fucked so hard that you can feel them in your stomach long after you part ways? Gawd I love that!!! That's how I like to feel after hooking up. Better yet...carry me out on a stretcher!! That makes me a happy girl!!

Um,, well being a male,, I can honestly say I have never felt what you described.. However I have fucked someone the way you described and hours later I could still feel her pussy on my cock when she squeezed it so hard when she came I couldn't move it,,, now that was some good fuckin,,,,lol.

because it's safe to say that I'll never be involved in anything remotely similar.

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

Well, it's safe to say I'm not the type of woman you're looking for then. Neither are other women I know, but I suppose teenage boys wanking in front of their computers could be worth a thought. But of course I started using the internet when half of the girls were still boys trying to make it more interesting, so my views are a bit old-fashioned.

[randomperson]

Um.. being a virgin some of these posts are ahem a bit foreign to me lol.

But I think the ladies do have a point, play up to your strengths. Everyone is right about one thing you have to play with the cards your dealt. The women your talking about sound shallow, like one night stands. You don't need that in your life anyway.

As I said in the first sentence I'm by far an expert but I think there are multiple ways to make a woman think of you, yearn for you.. use your imaginations

Think I am going to step away from this thread it is a little.. sexually intense for me haha. But don't give up hope. I am in my early 30s only kissed one woman and I still have hope. Sounds like everyone in here has had women care for them more than that so use it to help you feel better.

I do appreciate the lessons learned from this thread. Thanks to all.