What Do I Do? (!) Trigger Warning (!)

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

Well, excuse me, but to me "you should have established boundaries" or if you want "but healthy boundaries are so important for kids and we have to provide them" is the same as putting blame on SR. I can understand his frustration and I think no "oh, you're just imagining things" will change that.

There's still no use questioning everything you've done, sr. There's no point going back and making something a problem that never before was one. You already have one of those to deal with.

Take care.

I'm afraid this might mean I'm stepping out of the thread, because the number of people I'm arguing against is getting tiresome.

[IrmaJean]

I'm afraid this might mean I'm stepping out of the thread, because the number of people I'm arguing against is getting tiresome.

I'd really hate to see that happen, SoO. You've been a positive and calming voice of support here to SR.

I think we have a lot of diverse views here, and diversity can be a positive thing. I don't want to see us get caught up in arguing "right"/"wrong". I think we're all on the same side. We want to support SR. We've given him some different viewpoints to consider. The choices of what to do with this or not to do with this are entirely his.

SR, how can we best support you? What do you need right now in this? I hope therapy went okay today. How are you feeling now?

[Musicman]

While I very much disagree with most of what Chisholm has suggested, she posed a great question a few posts back: What would it take for you to come to terms with what you did?

I have so much to say to you about yours and everyones' posts since I last checked these forums last night. Unfortunately, there is far too much for me to talk about. Doing so would take hours upon hours to fully analyze, and I would very likely miss out on a large chunk.

SR, did you go to therapy today? How was it?

SoO, I encourage you not to leave this thread. You've been a gentle a voice and have had many good, worthwhile suggestions. You aren't alone in your arguments. The two of us seem to agree on most aspects, and so does IrmaJean. The only person who could be hurt by you leaving is SR.

[soregretful]

While I very much disagree with most of what Chisholm has suggested, she posed a great question a few posts back: What would it take for you to come to terms with what you did?

That is just it, no matter what, I will not be able to come to terms with this. No way. I am just horrible because of this. No how. No amount of therapy.

Therapy was just a background today. 300 bucks. 300 bucks that could have been saved it I wasn't such an idiot. What is wrong with me?!?! I hate this and that I was so stupid!

[Sissagwaad]

wow, what can I saY? What can I admire?

what passion. What determination. Wow

Seems like you have it all sewed up pretty good, yup.

What can I do but respect you're choice, and love you just the same.

[Sissagwaad]

So you're saying you spent to have 2 hrs consulting with a professional.

What if anything we're you able to hear, or were you willing to hear?

It probably started with something to the effect, why are you here? and why were you there?

Were you able to focus or speak to where you rationally want to be, emotionally?

Were you open to or discuss any of the bountiful effective tools that are available to you to improve your emotional health?

[Musicman]

That is just it, no matter what, I will not be able to come to terms with this. No way. I am just horrible because of this. No how. No amount of therapy.

Therapy was just a background today. 300 bucks. 300 bucks that could have been saved it I wasn't such an idiot. What is wrong with me?!?! I hate this and that I was so stupid!

If this is the case SR, why did you ever start posting here? You know somewhere deep down that you can get better.

What's the point of money if you can't enjoy life?

I think it's time you stop asking yourself why you did what you did. You made a dumb mistake, but that doesn't make you an idiot. You, yourself, admitted several times that the only hurt party was yourself. You're angry that you did this to yourself. If that's the case, why would you subject yourself to further torture? You hate yourself for destroying your own life, but in reality, your life was never destroyed. The only thing destroying your life is your inability to let go. Believe me, I mean this in the gentlest way possible. I'm battling my own demons, and I know how difficult it can be to just "forget about what happened." Ultimately, though, it all comes down to what you once told me: It all depends on how bad you want it. These words are wiser than you may have initially thought. They convinced me to once again try becoming clean. You've greatly helped me when I thought there was nowhere else to turn and no one else to talk to. Now, I'd like to help repay the favor.

SR, please be gentle with yourself.

[soregretful]

wow, what can I saY? What can I admire?

what passion. What determination. Wow

Seems like you have it all sewed up pretty good, yup.

What can I do but respect you're choice, and love you just the same.

Bottom line is I bet, not judging, that none of you would know what to do if you were in my shoes either. If you knew you had done something that just effected you, that is who you would have to battle with. If you can honestly put yourself in my shoes and tell me what you would do, I would listen. I mean, yeah, I am posting to get help, I am not lying. I can not figure out what to do, and this is me NOT giving up. I guess the open ended thing to do would be to say Nothing has worked yet. I am tired of saying that, because if this is a simple problem to leave behind, I would like to know how to do it. I mean, I figured on the off chance someone else did this they could offer advice. Therapy was just a background thing today. Not really any techniques or exercises or anything.

I even showed my therapist what I looked at. I am just not hearing anyone when they say I am not looking for help, because guess what, I am. That's why I have been to all these therapists, that's why I have been on here. Right now, my problem is that I will be the little old man, presuming I made it that far, that looked at the Chippendiddys. That thought is not at all appealing.

[soregretful]

Well, excuse me, but to me "you should have established boundaries" or if you want "but healthy boundaries are so important for kids and we have to provide them" is the same as putting blame on SR. I can understand his frustration and I think no "oh, you're just imagining things" will change that.

UOTE]

SoO, thanks! This is ESACTLY how I feel. This whole boundary thing makes me feel like I am a bad guy here. I ask you, do the parents have any blame in this? After all, this was their children. I loved them sure, but is it MY job to put boundaries in place or question boundaries that the parents set? Yeah, I am an adult, but the boundaries should have been set by the parents. If they had no problem with me cuddling and cozing, why should I have?

[Musicman]

SoO, thanks! This is ESACTLY how I feel. This whole boundary thing makes me feel like I am a bad guy here. I ask you, do the parents have any blame in this? After all, this was their children. I loved them sure, but is it MY job to put boundaries in place or question boundaries that the parents set? Yeah, I am an adult, but the boundaries should have been set by the parents. If they had no problem with me cuddling and cozing, why should I have?

SR, you didn't cross any boundaries. The parents are well aware of your situation with the boys. When you shared a bed with them, you brought relief to their misery. There are a lot of creepy people out there who would kill to share a bed with those boys, but you are not one of them. The only thing you gained out of this was the knowledge that you helped them in a time of need. I see no reason to regret having ever done this or any other display of affection you've shown towards the boys. All I can say is that I wish I had someone to show me that same affection both now and as a child.

SR, in case you were referring to me in your previous post when you said you were tired of people accusing you of not trying, let me clarify that I'm not making this accusation at all. The mere fact that you've joined these forums and post regularly means you're trying. The fact that you are seeing a new psychologist, even though you are having trouble affording it, and even though your last experiences with one were miserable, means that you're trying.

The truth is that no matter how much you believe it, you won't be "that little old man that looked at the Chippendiddys. You will be the "old man who while he did something he terribly regretted, also helped hundreds of children and by doing so, made the world a better place."

SR, are you on any anti-depressants? I think it could be very beneficial to ask your psychologist about trying some.

[Sissagwaad]

Why is blame an issue or important?

What happened happened. This is an issue of you not feeling comfortable forgiving yourself or letting yourself off this huge hook you've put yourself on.

I don't like to put down any therapist, but using up 2 hrs to rumage around in old history, well, i can't help thinking she's playing the meter. Very old school, and not progressive or much considerate of your financial plight, or the simplicity of what it is you are doing, torchering yourself as you are. How did you leave things then?

There are all kinds of parents, some more intelligent and savy than others, but you alone are the best judge of you. You expressed concern about becoming aroused, which can and often happens. it is not unusual or criminal. you expressed a big hang up about making yourself up so dispicable for simply enjoying your sexuality when you saw some kids jumping about in speedos. So, It is therefore your business alone to discern whether or not excessive affection, leads you to difficulties or not. No one else knows what it is like to walk in your shoes.

What were some of your thoughts after spending 2hrs on your history? did the therapist explain her method of engaging with and being with her clients?

As i shared with you earlier, i'm sure i can come up with effective therapists that will help you sort yourself out for $50 an hour on the phone, if you are not located anywhere near them. hugs bw

[soregretful]

Hey,

I am willing to try anything. That was expensive!!

[soregretful]

I am so tired of this. I made a mistake. Do I have to pay for it with my life? I am so sad. I feel like this will never end. Sissa, do you think there is a way where this just won't attack me every day of my life? I am so freaking sad. I am like insane with guilt. I can't believe this. I am so sorry. I need help...I want help, but I don't know where to go for help. I just don't like the idea of having enjoyed my sexuality, and who knows to what extent I did, while looking at kids! These could have been one of my little buds or any of the kids I teach. I want rest. I want peace. I want this to just be over. Am I really going to wake up every day and think Speedo Kid for the rest of my life? I am so so done. I mean, I pulled up the websites for the psychiatrist and they were dated early 2000s. This may be long after I looked at them. Nonetheless, it shows that this crap was shut down YEARS ago before I even met the boys and I was living life totally fine! Why all of a sudden is this jumping in to kill me? I want this to be over. I went to confession. God, I am so sorry! Are there some sins you don't forgive? This feels like one of them. I want to just be happy again! Everything I do for the rest of my life seems like it will have a speedo kid with it. I am so sorry! Why? Why did I do this to myself?

[Musicman]

Hey,

I am willing to try anything. That was expensive!!

That's the spirit, SR. Never give up. I'm seeing the truth to this statement more and more since I started posting here.

Perhaps I should further clarify a suggestion I previously made about anti-depressants. While they can help to stabilize one's mood, they are also known to have terrible side effects on certain people. Are you currently taking any? If you are, maybe you should stop and see where it takes you. If you're not, trying them for a few weeks might be worth a shot.

More so than anything, though, I think it's extremely important for you to talk to your psychologist about controlling your anxiety. Once you can do that, you will better be able to rationalize with yourself, rather than always pinning yourself as scum.

[soregretful]

No,

I am not taking any medication anymore for anything. Bottom line is it will not help as much as some of the therapy might. I don't know. I just don't know. I am going to be the old little man that looked at the Chippendiddys. I don't like that title, and I don't know what I can do to feel better. I came on here with the sheer hope that someone else did something similar and could recommend therapies, etc. THIS SUCKS!!!!!!! Why did I do myself so damn bad?

Guys, I am telling you this in hopes that someone has something that they can tell me to help me quick....though I did nothing to hurt anyone, I seriously do have a plan to commit suicide. I am working on securing the means. I have found a place locally and am taking steps towards getting the means I want for this plan. I didn't think it would come to this, but like I said, I can not live knowing I did this for the rest of my life. I can not be the speedo bandito at any age. I can't! I can't think that perhaps I pleasured myself looking at kids....I can't. Is there anything I can do to hasten this process because once summer rolls around, I am afraid of what might happen if I don't feel a little relief. I am not so scared that I won't make it happen though.

[danni]

SR....

It worries me that you have stopped taking your meds. Did you discuss this with your psychiatrist? They can really help with the intrusive thoughts. Evidence actually shows that it is the combination of meds and therapy that produces the best results. The meds don't "fix" things but they can take the bottom out and help you manage and cope while you are going through the therapy process.

If you are planning suicide and gathering the means, please go to the hospital. They are there to help keep you safe. Talk about this with your psychiatrist and your therapist.

[Sissagwaad]

I am so tired of this. I made a mistake. Do I have to pay for it with my life? I am so sad. I feel like this will never end. Sissa, do you think there is a way where this just won't attack me every day of my life? I am so freaking sad. I am like insane with guilt. I can't believe this. I am so sorry. I need help...I want help, but I don't know where to go for help. I just don't like the idea of having enjoyed my sexuality, and who knows to what extent I did, while looking at kids! These could have been one of my little buds or any of the kids I teach. I want rest. I want peace. I want this to just be over. Am I really going to wake up every day and think Speedo Kid for the rest of my life? I am so so done. I mean, I pulled up the websites for the psychiatrist and they were dated early 2000s. This may be long after I looked at them. Nonetheless, it shows that this crap was shut down YEARS ago before I even met the boys and I was living life totally fine! Why all of a sudden is this jumping in to kill me? I want this to be over. I went to confession. God, I am so sorry! Are there some sins you don't forgive? This feels like one of them. I want to just be happy again! Everything I do for the rest of my life seems like it will have a speedo kid with it. I am so sorry! Why? Why did I do this to myself?

my thoughts reading this, vs your last post, i prefer the work you seemed to be doing above.

Do you do any of this with paper and pencil?

Are you approaching this as a true student? (A student of yourself, and of life)

Do you notice how you allow your focus to change in the second posting?

Thank goodness you have your head on fairly straight as far as not relying on drugs to attempt relief from your symptoms.

Your symptoms, and pain, is your body's way of communicating to you.

It is saying hey, something here I don't like. Something is being injested, inputted that really doesn't sit well with me.

Something has to change, is what it is saying. Could it be simply something different, a change, perhaps in how you are thinking, seeing, yourself?

Questions are the Answer. Ask relatively 'garbage,' dead-end questions, one gets only answers in kind.

Look therefore to learning to give yourself more useful questions. Why, is really not a particularly useful question.

Aim to accept past as past more, rather than direct yourself into looking backward, rather direct yourself present, and forward, and never underestimate the value of gratitude, no matter how small or insignificant you might judge it.

in the response above you speak to a lot of wants. What about putting them down in your study book?

After you've got several pictures of what you are wanting as to the quality of life, and how it will feel living it, the next step of the exercise, could be to continue to direct your faculties by giving yourself more useful questions such as How can I......What do I have to do.....What more can I do, What more have I to do, Where can I find the answeers to How can I....etc....Even though I may have once......how can I.....etc etc....

Our minds are amazingly resiliant, resourceful, powerful, magnetic.

What we focus ourselves on we invariably draw to ourselves and make larger.

Give yourself the gift of more useful questions, and fill yourself with the quest, and i assure you, you cannot fail my friend.

love and hugs bw

[Sissagwaad]

I am so tired of this. I made a mistake. Do I have to pay for it with my life? you seem to believe you do, do you believe this?

I am so sad. I feel like this will never end. yes understandably you could feel sad about never ending this self-punishment

Sissa, do you think there is a way where this just won't attack me every day of my life? What i choose to think I do for me, what do you believe?

I am so freaking sad. I am like insane with guilt. I can't believe this. I am so sorry. I need help. "need" sort of implies not being able to help yourself, victimization thinking. Would it not be suffice to convey recognition your simply wanting help?

I want help, but I don't know where to go for help. here is an example of defusing the focus with a put-down limiting judgement....more useful questions without the judgemental put down. ie."Where do I go for help"

I just don't like the idea of having enjoyed my sexuality, and who knows to what extent I did, while looking at kids!

These could have been one of my little buds or any of the kids I teach. I want rest. I want peace. again specifics, your giving yourself, your body, your emotions programing. (I could probably guess, and so can your body, but lets give it all the specifics we can, as to what exactly your aiming yourself towards and how it is 'going to be,' (try to approach this as your lifelong course in what it is to be human, striving for and towards :"feeling and experiencing authentically being loved and loveable"

I want this to just be over. What this exactly? Without specifics we confuse our resources.

Am I really going to wake up every day and think Speedo Kid for the rest of my life? Really, what anyone else thinks is not your business. What do you think, and what are you wanting.....work at remaining focused.

I am so so done. I mean, I pulled up the websites for the psychiatrist and they were dated early 2000s.

This may be long after I looked at them. Nonetheless, it shows that this crap was shut down YEARS ago before I even met the boys and I was living life totally fine!

Why all of a sudden is this jumping in to kill me? Pardon? what exactly is 'jumping in to kill you?'

I want this to be over. I went to confession. God, I am so sorry! Are there some sins you don't forgive? Again, this is entirely about your choice of beliefs. What do you believe? Well, next thought indicates you do believe there are 'some sins' that are unforgiveable. What would happen, or would it mean, if you no longer believed that?

This feels like one of them. I want to just be happy again! what specifically will 'just being happy' be like? Define wants with specifity, like planing your trip, then give yourself useful questions, like what do i do next, how can i get more, increase whatever, where could i look? etc

Everything I do for the rest of my life seems like it will have a speedo kid with it. yes, it might 'seem' that way, but only you determine the quality of your emotional life from this moment on.

ok, now i'll get off my makeshift therapist soapbox, and go back to bed. Keep on studying grasshopper You too can be an excellent student.

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

The memory isn't what you need to get away from, the attached guilt is.

Did you know one of the ten famous cognitive distortions is emotional reasoning? You feel something, therefore it must be true - doesn't work well.

Why isn't therapy in the foreground?

[IrmaJean]

SR, please know that I care about your well-being and wish for you to heal, but you continue to voice thoughts that are distorted. This seems (to me) as if it is an attempt to rationalize your behaviors. I feel it is very important to point this out to you. It is never my wish to upset you, but I do hope that you are able to understand. I mean all of this very gently and with compassion for you and your experience.

I loved them sure' date=' but is it MY job to put boundaries in place or question boundaries that the parents set? [/quote']

Yes, it is your job. Yes, it should have been the parents’ job, too, but their allowing something doesn’t make it then okay for you to allow it. When there are children involved (and again I’m not talking specifically about any interactions between you and the boys), one must always protect the children. When you are interacting with children, you are responsible for protecting their rights. A parent saying that something is okay does not always make it so. You use your own judgment. In the end, you are responsible for keeping children that you interact with safe from harm. Again, I am not referencing anything specific, but more your thought patterns in this.

Yeah' date=' I am an adult, but the boundaries should have been set by the parents. If they had no problem with me cuddling and cozing, why should I have?[/quote']

I want to address your pattern of rationalizing. If someone tells you to do something, but you sense/feel it is uncomfortable, you should always trust your instincts and don’t do it. You don’t do things simply because someone else tells you to. You look at the situation and make your own choices and your own decisions because, ultimately, you are responsible for your own behaviors.

As to boundaries, they are very important to establish in any relationship. They are especially important to teach young children. This helps them to develop a sense of self which will serve them greatly as they grow into adults. Even within adult relationships, boundaries are important. They help us learn to respect ourselves and others. They help us protect ourselves and keep ourselves safe. They help us to value and love ourselves. So very important.

All I can say is that I wish I had someone to show me that same affection both now and as a child.

MM, it’s hard sometimes to not look at things through our own life experiences. It sounds as though you were not given the type of affection that you needed as a child. I’m sorry that this happened. In saying that, your experiences do not reflect on SR’s. It’s a different situation. Different dynamic. Different people.

Why set boundaries when there is no evident victim?

All relationships need boundaries. This is especially important to teach and instill in young children. This teaches self-care and self-love and promotes a healthy sense of self-worth.

Changing patterns of thought can be challenging, SR. The first instinct is to fight them off, and defend what you have become familiar with. I’ve done it too. Maybe try relaxing your body and letting the thoughts then have a chance in your mind. I say all of this, SR, not for you to question anything that you have done in the past, but for you to move forward in life with new knowledge that you may apply to new experiences. We can always continue to grow as human beings. Learning never ends if we are open to this. Isn’t that an amazing thing?

With respect and concern,

Beth

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

Tiresome. I can only imagine the effects on someone actually concerned. I'm not really concerned and I'm feeling quite sad. I don't believe this thread is doing more good than bad. I can only imagine sr would benefit from getting a break too and from investing more energies into real therapy.

[soregretful]

OK,

Let's just pretend for a second that boundaries are the least of my worries and that I don't particularly care whose job it was to set or enforce them. Let's just pretend for a second that my issue is the guilt for the internet thing. Because what's done is done with the boys....I don't really care too much about boundaries because three adults were OK with it. I could care less about having slept with the kids etc. That is not the issue I need help with. That is not the issue I am suicidal about...it is this guilt. When I hear, oh, you should have set boundaries, etc. that only makes me feel like I did something further wrong. I could care less about boundaries, because let's just say for a minute I need to save my own butt and maybe will never see the kids again. This is so not about boundaries for me right now. I know in my heart I did was right and I will not second guess that for one second.

Now, the issue at hand is the guilt. I don't care about any boundaries.....that is ancillary to this issue. I don't care if I slept with the boys or whatever, because that is NOT WHAT I AM FEELING BAD ABOUT!! I need to get by the internet stuff. Maybe I should have never brought the boys into this, because they really have nothing to do with my problem. Yeah, there is the occasional arousal....that is not what I am most concerned about. How the heck do I beat the guilt?

[Sissagwaad]

just engage in dialogue with the people i suggested my friend.

It will all work out fine. You have your reasons for feeling guilty,

and they can help you sort out what you want to hold onto,

and help you realize your power to enable yourself to 'do yourself differently'

[IrmaJean]

I can only imagine sr would benefit from getting a break too and from investing more energies into real therapy.

I think this is a very wise idea.

[Musicman]

SR, for the love of God, if you feel you may harm yourself, check yourself into a hospital. You will never have the chance to take it back once it's done. You will permanently scar many people in the process, including your parents, girlfriend, and the boys. I post here because I deeply care about your wellbeing. If you were to make any rash decisions, I would feel responsible for not having being able to help you.

I agree with you on the fact that the boundaries are not the issue. Whether stricter boundaries should have been set (which I wholeheartedly disagree with) or not, this is not the problem at hand. Setting stricter boundaries would affect the children, not you. If there is a party being harmed by loose boundaries (which I don't believe there is,) it's the boys. Right now, we are here to help you.

If you feel that using these forums is only making you more depressed, I urge you to take a break from here for a while. Concentrate on your actual therapy.