So sorry

[soregretful]

I am just at a loss. Sissa, I DO NOT WANT to beat myself up....I feel like I already did. My only wants right now are not good. I want to be off of this Earth. I want to be gone. I don't think there is any way to get rid of the pain, or at least that I have discovered yet. I am just tired of being told that I am not trying...I AM!!!!!!!!!!! I am the one who begged to go to therapy. I am the one who came clean to my parents. I am the one who thought maybe it would be helpful to blog. I am doing everything I know how to not kill myself. Living like crap is the closest I can come to it.

[hatemeds]

you really don't want to believe it is possible to recover, or to change?

I think Sissagwaad's hit bullseye. Sometimes its easier to stay sick and thrash around in self destructive familiarity rather than risk change for the better/the unknown. Sometimes changing patterns is the most frightening thing of all?

You know you can do it SR - its staring you in the face - I dare you to take hold of the key!

[soregretful]

Best parents in the world! No abuse, no fights, nothing. My dad's dad died when he was 9. He had to be man of the house since then. He is the best dad ever. There is no issue of how he raised me. Childhood was lonely. We lived in a neighborhood with no other kids really but one or 2.

If I didn't have this memory, I would be in heaven. I would not have anything to obsess about because other than this flaw, I have had a great life. I love my job, I love helping kids, everything! Until December of this year, I was OK. I started dating with a clean mind, and like 2 months into the relationship, this comes up. I don't know why! :confused: I am just PO'd that I put it there.

So, am I just supposed to stand up on the altar on my wedding day thinking, oh, I looked at kids in speedos when I was younger? That doesn't seem quite spouseworthy. I want to get better guys...I do not want to stay sick. That is why I came here. I am doing everything I can to feel better. I am not giving up, as everyone thinks. I am working overtime to feel like I am worthy of living.

[Sissagwaad]

I am just at a loss. Sissa, I DO NOT WANT to beat myself up....I feel like I already did. My only wants right now are not good. I want to be off of this Earth. I want to be gone. I don't think there is any way to get rid of the pain, or at least that I have discovered yet. I am just tired of being told that I am not trying...I AM!!!!!!!!!!! I am the one who begged to go to therapy. I am the one who came clean to my parents. I am the one who thought maybe it would be helpful to blog.

I am doing everything I know how to not kill myself. Living like crap is the closest I can come to it.

????why would you choose/want to live like crap, be closest to killing oneself?

"I feel like I already did" Yah, you 'did,' and that is OK....

Can't do a tinkers-damn about what any of us 'has done.'

It's what you are choosing to 'do' that is what living/life is about.

Forget about 'trying' no one is saying anything about you trying or not trying, because it doesn't count for a tinkers-damn either.

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

I’ll begin with saying I’m no expert, because I have a habit of sounding like one. Although, sometimes I sound like an idiot.

You’re having repetetive negative thoughts that don’t allow for much variation and are difficult to let go off and a severe lack of self-esteem. It’s typical of mental illnesses to be trapped in a cycle of negative thoughts about yourself, the world and the future, and the more often you walk along those paths, the broader they get, because the brain adapts. It makes broad ways out of paths that are often used.

It’s also typical that people don’t get out of it on their own. It can help to take meds to change the brain chemistry and to have therapy to learn using different paths in your head, making the broad paths small and the narrow ones broad. It’s not like people just flip a switch and are happy as far as I know.

You’re doing the right things trying to escape. If you’re already taking meds, you could question whether they are working, because they might not. Therapy-wise I agree with malign and you could read about some cbt skills for thought stopping. According to CBT it’s thoughts -> emotions -> behaviour, so when you feel bad it’s due to negative self-talk, which, if I remember correctly falls into ten general forms of distorted thoughts, like „I will never be happy“. All in all, thoughts that have no purpose other than making you feel bad and are inacurate, because they generalize, do fortune-telling, or.. about 8 other things I can’t remember at the moment. So all „I will never be happy“ does is making sure that you feel bad right now. It certainly doesn't help you to feel happy. If you feel bad right now, you’re likely to have negative thoughts about yourself that you believe are true. And they look totally true until you find discrepancy. You find discrepancy when you believe that you’re a dumbass who doesn’t deserve to live is true, while at the same time you believe someone in a similar situation deserves to get out of the trap and live a happy life. How can that be? How can it be that I think when I need therapy it means I’m weak, while when I imagine a friend having therapy it means they are strong? It can’t. It’s a lie. You’re someone who deserves to get out of the trap and live a happy life. And you do get out of the trap by stopping to believe the lies. After you've identified them.

I hope this helps a little. If it doesn't help, don't worry about it.

S.

[soregretful]

OK,

I do not want to be sad anymore. The first thing I am going to try to do is break this down. First of all, I think people are going to be appalled when I tell them what I did. I treat it like it is the worst thing on Earth. No one seemed to even react here. Why does this not seem to carry as much weight for you guys as it does for me? Other than the fact that it is not your problem....why is it that I think that people are going to be horrified or disgusted or label me some kind of pedowhatever when I say this to them. I guess I am trying to look at this problem from outside of myself. Why does this not seem to be a big deal to anyone else? Why does it not disgust you or make you immediately think I am disgusting.

This is my first step because I want to set that as my mantra in making this ease up a little. Why is this not horrible? I know it only matters what I think, but just for now, let's hear what you think.

[malign]

But isn't this course of action completely safe, for you? You basically ask us to prove to you a negative hypothesis ("this is not a problem"), and at any time, you can dismiss it all with "that's just what you guys think." There are plenty of examples within this exact thread of why we don't think this is a big deal. You seem to be ignoring those; why repeat them?

Let's switch it back to you: would you require someone else to do the penance you're imposing on yourself? What if your lady friend, say, used to fantasize about something that you would find appalling {you'd have to fill in what that would be, for you}, but she doesn't do it any more. She never acted on those fantasies, never hurt anyone else, just imagined something. Would you require her to think about it all the time, to beat herself up about it continuously, to wonder whether she'd be thinking about it when she said her vows? If you are applying a double standard, you need to be aware of it.

[soregretful]

That is just it, malign. The problem I have is with myself. I find it disgusting. That is why I am having a hard time. I find it hard to believe I even did this. That is why I can't let it go, according to my therapist. I have so much emotion built into this that it is always in my head. If I were to find some way to treat it like any other mistake, cheating on a test, etc. the meaning would be gone and it would just fade away. Because I have so much invested in this, that is why it is so permanant.

[malign]

Doesn't sound like a very productive investment. ;-)

It was still a fairly oblique answer. It wouldn't be disgusting in someone else, but it is in you? How much have you discussed it with your therapist, and what else did they say?

One of the things that medications can offer you is a reduction in the intensity of the anxiety that's associated with these thoughts, so that you can explore them with less pain. As Sissa says, the meds don't solve problems; all I'm suggesting is that they may help make it possible for you to solve them.

Too, when I asked about parents and your childhood, it wasn't to seek someone to blame. But most of us are formed by those early years, so it makes sense to search for what bothers us there. For instance, we now know that you were lonely as a child, and that you wanted a speedo that you didn't get. What would it have meant to you, if you had been allowed to have a speedo?

{By the way, no one's accusing you of not trying, just that what you're trying isn't working where other things might, things that we can see more easily than you can.}

[soregretful]

I don't know why, but I think that the speedo meant a lot to me as a kid. I remember first seeing a kid wearing one and thinking man that looks cool. That was me as a little boy. Even as I grew, I liked wearing tight fitting clothes, and even today, I have about 50 Under Armour shirts....before any of this started. I can remember cutting up a pair of spandex shorts I had to try to make a speedo. It didn't go very well. I can remember asking to get a speedo when I was about 9-10 years old to be told no. Maybe if I had gotten it, I wouldn't be here right now. I don't know why it held so much meaning. Like I said, I signed up for swim teams just to wear one. When I got my driver's license, that is one of the first things I went out and bought. I never really wore it in public except for a few times, but damn, I just had to have it. I don't know why, but it held a ton of meaning for me. I have massed a collection over the past years...though I probably won't wear them too much. I don't know why but it probably would have meant a lot to me to get one. That doesn't justify that I went out and did what I did, but it was always, always, always a speedo thing. I never searched for any CP, always speedos. Who the heck knows?

The fact that I "pleasured myself" to me is acting on it. It was never about anything but speedos, though. So, how do I get it to the point where this is just a mistake and it can fade away. I don't know!!

[IrmaJean]

So then this is about the speedos and not the children, don't you think?

Not because it is normal' date=' but because it would make me feel good. I do not want to die lonely.[/quote']

I pulled this from a response you posted in another thread. When you consider love and connections with others, the good feelings you have about yourself would hopefully come from within and not be dependent on others.

Becoming a father is a huge responsibility. It isn't something you'd want to take on to feel good or to combat loneliness. Could it be that as much as you are wanting this (being a father), you fear it as well?

[Sissagwaad]

That is just it, malign. The problem I have is with myself. I find it disgusting. The disgusting aspect, is how you maintain, not wanting to accept you are human. Bound to have errors in judgement, and value recognizing these as useful lessons, and to go on growing, and authentically rejoiceful.

That is why I am having a hard time. I find it hard to believe I even did this. That is why I can't let it go, according to my therapist. Exactly. Afraid to let it go, because you haven't simply accepted the occasion as just another lesson to value and to grow from

I have so much emotion built into this that it is always in my head.

If I were to find some way to treat it like any other mistake, cheating on a test, etc. the meaning would be gone and it would just fade away.

Because I have so much invested in this, that is why it is so permanant.

Exactly. You've invested so much into being sorryful, soregretful, that you can't bear to consider letting it pass, and you've made it seem permanent.

Are you truly interested, in finding ways in 'treating it like the simple lapse in sensibleness,' that you normally find yourself in?

What are you doing about that?

[Musicman]

OK,

I do not want to be sad anymore. The first thing I am going to try to do is break this down. First of all, I think people are going to be appalled when I tell them what I did. I treat it like it is the worst thing on Earth. No one seemed to even react here. Why does this not seem to carry as much weight for you guys as it does for me? Other than the fact that it is not your problem....why is it that I think that people are going to be horrified or disgusted or label me some kind of pedowhatever when I say this to them. I guess I am trying to look at this problem from outside of myself. Why does this not seem to be a big deal to anyone else? Why does it not disgust you or make you immediately think I am disgusting.

This is my first step because I want to set that as my mantra in making this ease up a little. Why is this not horrible? I know it only matters what I think, but just for now, let's hear what you think.

If I may paraphrase what I previously said: First off, it is important to note that you are in no way a pedophile. You never wanted to engage in any relations with a child. You are viewing yourself the way that society views pedophiles. Society thinks that pedophiles are monsters looking to attack their pray. While this sadly is true for a large number of pedophiles, this is not always the case. There are pedophiles who would like nothing more than to get help -- those who would sooner die before they molest a child. The reason that people on this board aren't judging you (or me for that matter) is that they know that anyone posting here is looking for help.

[soregretful]

Sissa,

That is exactly how I want to view it!! Right now, it is like viewing shooting someone as a lapse of judgment though. I don't get it. To be quite honest, I do not even know if I even pleasured myself that much....right now I am just more disappointed that I looked!!! Not sure I understand life anymore!

[soregretful]

I feel like I am going insane!! I really don't remember much of anything anymore other than I did something I regret. This is such a sad day...I am a good person. My mind is just fried.

[Sissagwaad]

Sissa,

That is exactly how I want to view it!! Right now, it is like viewing shooting someone as a lapse of judgment though. I don't get it. To be quite honest, I do not even know if I even pleasured myself that much....right now I am just more disappointed that I looked!!! Not sure I understand life anymore!

What Do you really 'have to' understand, before you can for you choose to let go of putting yourself down?

Perhaps Understand you are simply human?

Understand failures, 'mistakes,' are a basic useful method of learning what one does and does not want to repeat. (And therefore not having to be a continual source or resource for worrying and fretting?)

[Sissagwaad]

"This is such a sad day...I am a good person. My mind is just fried."

Three widely varying 'statements of belief.

Do you think the middle one is useful?

What about the last one? Are you sure? Do you really believe this? Or is it just feeling that way? (The difference has a considerable effect on your self esteem, and how you ultimately feel.)

The first is a focused value judgement in support of experiencing sadness.

How Is it important or useful to look back on your day in such terms?

What do you dedicate each day to doing?

Do you consciously decide what you will be looking for?

(it is a widely held truth that what we look for, focus on, we generally get)

Do you invite, and remind yourself of the presence of a higher power, being with you every moment?

Do you celebrate realization of this loving support?

What about dedicating yourself towards learning to be increasingly discerning about the quality of your internal self-talk?

[soregretful]

Why would anyone want to live in misery? I don't understand people saying I am beating myself up. Like if I had the choice, I would beat myself? I will say "I'm not sure" if I can have a sane mind again, because at this point, who the heck knows? Like I said, I am at the point where I don't even remember what I did. All I really know is I visited some sites that I wish I hadn't. Who the heck knows? Does it really matter? Do I want to get better.....uh, yeah. Why would I intentionally punish myself? I don't get it.

All I know is that on August 24, 2010, life as I know it changed forever. That is the day my grandma died. That is the last day I can recall being somewhat normal. I wish people would stop saying I am feeling sorry for myself...that is the last thing I want to do. I don't want your pity, I want some guidance. I am not trying to be mean, but I really don't get the metaphor that I am beating myself up, like I want to feel that way on purpose. It isn't like I am saying everyone please feel sorry for me. I don't get it! Life like this sucks, and before anyone tells me, then live it some other way.....I DON'T KNOW HOW!!! (right now)

[Musicman]

The truth is that you ARE beating yourself up. This does not necessarily mean that you are feeling sorry for yourself. I've said some very minor idiotic things in my life that truthfully, no one remembers except for myself. For whatever reason, I cannot let go of them. At random times, the memories will just pop into my head. They are annoying, but I guess that they resurface so that I am reminded never to say such things again. Truthfully, I think what is happening to you is very similar, though much larger and much more important. If you let your brain beat you up like this, you'll never have a chance at happiness. Surely, you deserve it.

Perhaps it's best to distract yourself. Why not try listening to some music? It sounds cliche and idiotic, but whenever I'm upset, I do just that. Another suggestion would be to start watching movies. Since last summer, I've taken it on as somewhat of a hobby. Mainly, I pick meaningful dramas. I find that they give me a better outlook on the world. A few have even found their ways deep into my heart. Or, you can think of something else to do with your time. The important thing is that you just set aside a period of time when you tell yourself that you may not think about your sorrows. If you find your mind wandering onto the subject during this time, force yourself to stop.

[soregretful]

I know why I don't view this as a mistake.....because it is something I CHOSE to see/do/whatever. A mistake implies that something was accidental. By the very nature of the definition....this was not an accident. For whatever dumbass reason...I chose to look at this crap. That is why it is so hard to forgive myself. I chose and I chose very very very very very very poorly. So, this was no accident.....it can not be looked at as a mistake, because I chose it. So for those who think I am beating myself up, maybe I am, because I chose to be stupid.

[Luna-]

Hi SR. I just read this thread. What medication are you taking for your OCD?

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

Hi sr,

I can see that you ask for guidance and I see that you do everything you know of to feel better. In some posts that seems to go underappreciated. It’s good that you say you are not sure if you can have a sane mind again, because that means it’s possible that you will have a sane mind again and it’s worth working on it.

Do you remember how you felt when you wrote the post about breaking things down?

Because I think the post has an open and exploring tone to it that sounds positive to me. If you want to stick to why-questions, it would be: why did you expect that people are appalled? If people are not appalled, what does that mean? That your expectation was wrong? Maybe that the underlying idea is questionable?

Your question was why it is not horrible. I don’t know. Is it horrible to like speedos? Is it horrible to masturbate? Is it horrible that teenagers explore their sexuality? I just think it’s horrible to have a mental illness.

I could imagine that your feelings about your grandmas death somehow caused this overwhelming guilt. Would you like to talk about what happened then?

Take care,

S.

[Sissagwaad]

I know why I don't view this as a mistake.....because it is something I CHOSE to see/do/whatever.

A mistake implies that something was accidental.

Exactly, it is because of these beliefs you continue to hold.

What if you no longer believed because you chose whatever action, it rules out being a mistake?

do you believe a mistake in judgement, cannot be an accidental choice?

By the very nature of the definition....this was not an accident.

For whatever dumbass reason...I chose to look at this crap.

That is why it is so hard to forgive myself. I chose and I chose very very very very very very poorly.

Again.....what if you chose to drop those harsh and unforgiving beliefs, for ones that permitted you to experience self-forgiveness, and authentic joy of having grown, from learning from this?

So, this was no accident.....it can not be looked at as a mistake, because I chose it. That is purely your choice, for your reasons of martrydom. Realize your freedom, or continue to choose to be victim

So for those who think I am beating myself up, maybe I am, because I chose to be stupid.

Whatever.

That was then, this is now.

Embracing ones dumbness/stupidity, presents an opportunity to learn, whereas pretending to 'know it all, doesn't that only serve to prevent learning and growth?

I encourage you to continue exploring and realizing your freedom of choice on how you 'do yourself,' each and every awesome present moment my friend

[soregretful]

Here is the whole story.

On 8/24/10 - My life as I know it changed forever.

8/24/10 - My grandma dies. I am very close with her and sad. I read at her funeral. No Speedo stuff.

10/17/10 - Let me preface this by going back a few years. There is this family whose children I taught and I get very close with them. The boys adore me and I become a family friend. I am invited to go on trips and stuff with them, which I was invited to by the parents, and the kids were excited to have me along. I figure, why not, I deserve some fun.

Well, over the next few years, the family comes to rely on me more. There are times when I have to take the kids to school, pick them up, get their dinner, etc. because of events that are happening to them. Dad lost his job, and her mother dies on cancer in 2009. I am asked to please sit with the boys at the funeral to console them. I even have to stay a few nights with them when the parents have to go to the hospital, etc. The night of the funeral, the boys ask if I can stay with them to comfort them, and I say sure.

No speedo stuff yet, but on a camping trip on 10/17/10, that again, I was invited to, I realize that they are growing up and won't need me as much. It makes me sad and I feel like I am losing them. It leaves a hole in my heart.

1019/10 - I try to date my current girlfriend realizing the boys are not going to be in my life as much. She also knows the boys and loves how compassionate I was with them, which is why she says she likes me.

No speedo stuff yet, but I am extremely emotional about the boys, of which she is understanding.

12/3/10 - I am diagnosed with clincal depression. I can't even see the boys without crying. I love them. No speedo stuff yet.

12/15/10 - I literally wake up in a cold sweat and shout "Oh my God, the websites!" This is the night I try to take sleeping pills to go to bed and throw up several times in disgust. This is the hell I have been living for the past 4 1/2 months.

Stuff starts to happen now when I am with the boys, like I become somewhat aroused, though this never happened for the entire first three and a half years of our relationship. I go see a therapist and he says that my speedo thing may have left body sexually attracted to boys. He also calls what I did child porn. That is when I get suicidal.

So, that is it in a nutshell....my brain was using a lot of negative emotion pathways in the preceding months. If you can pick your jaw off the ground, let me know what you think. I am pissed that this comes along when I am trying to get my life for myself in order, because all I did was give.

[Guest SomethingOrOther]

What would my jaw do on the ground?

I realise that I already read many parts of this, but it's helpful to to have an overview. Do you feel you were able to work through the grief about your grandmas death before the grief about loosing the boys set in? It has not been a year yet, so how is it now?

S.